I formally submit. If you are actually able to get kills with these things then you're a better player than me. I just cant do it, the recoil is ridiculous. Went thru all that effort to get thorn and didnt flinch now i feel sick at the thought of having to use it to lvl it up its just that bad at the moment. And the bullshit amount of effort it takes to lvl exotic weapons will take me ages just to get the added stability let alone the 'thorns". *sigh* rant over i spose..