So you seriously object to doing a raid at 30? you are a dumbass, when the raid was released every one was a 29 or 30 doing it, and many groups completed it successfully. Without being a level 31. And like I said, no one forces you to cheese, you make that choice on your own, when I set up a raid group, now that I am a level 31 and I like to make my raids fast so I make sure to only let 31's in my raid group. and guess what man, just because someone is a level 31 doesn't mean they have a -blam!-ing clue. The bottom line is, the cheese has no effect on you unless you let it. If I get on tonight and cheese crota in 4 minutes, and you get on and run the same raid legit and win. did I have any effect on your game? The answer to that question is No. You can say level 31 is handed to you all you want, but you still have to grind out marks, which are still capped at 100 a week and 200 total, and you still have to grind out rank. so it isn't really handed to you, they set it up that way so you would spend more time playing their game to get decent gear, gear that not so long after I got it I broke it down. So supporting morons like the guy of who started this thread makes you look just as dumb assuming other people can affect your game that way.