LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - http://youtu.be/Et1deUMwHB0?t=19m04s, said: Bringing into play the long-dead Precursors as well, they are noted to have been genocided by the Forerunners in an all-out war, indicating that they were militarily weaker than the Forerunners, most likely in numbers as they were almost certainly technologically superior.   Yeah, you really haven't read Halo: Silentium.   Here's a hint, the Precursors let themselves be destroyed.   Bear, Greg (2013-03-19). Halo: Silentium (Forerunner) (p. 209).  Precursor hatred of Forerunners is central to establishing motive. They say Forerunners rose up, unprovoked, and destroyed them. The Precursors did not defend themselves. They marveled at the power of destruction, of reorganization. Their law includes the necessity of violating the very nature of law … And so they created the Flood to allow themselves the pleasure of watching, at a later date, the progress of their most violent and aggressive creations …   Hell, the Flood ARE the Precursors, and seeing how well the Forerunner-Flood War went for the former, can you still say with a straight face that the Precursors are weak?   LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - http://youtu.be/Et1deUMwHB0?t=19m04s, said:Block Quote  Now, on the topics of super weapons:   The Halo universe has the Halo Arrays and the Ark. The network is effectively a massive kill-switch, designed to basically cause the users to suicide and take their enemy with them. Each ring does not cover the entire galaxy, as noted by the fact a ring can be fired in one location without wiping out the entire galaxy, and that the plan was to originally have 11 such rings to cover the galaxy, while the Ark held the equipment to repopulate it. Thus, the rings do have a maximum effective range, and they are noted to be immobile. The effect of these weapons is comparable to a minefield, while it exists, it is dangerous for an attack to move with the area they protect. They are only valuable with the UNSC on the defensive, a major drawback.   Incorrect, Bornstellar Makes Eternal Lasting, the Iso-Didact, to ensure that the Installations didn't fall into Flood hands, had to continuously shuffle the Halo Arrays in Slipspace. Moving these gargantuan constructs constantly taxed slipspace, under the reconciliation effect, essentially weakening the speeds at which Forerunners could travel the galaxy.   LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - http://youtu.be/Et1deUMwHB0?t=19m04s, said:Block Quote The Death Star is a seriously overpowered conventional weapon, and as far a superweapons go, can be considered unexceptional in every way. Same goes for the World Devastators, and the Sun Crusher. While all of these could play havoc on UNSC war efforts, their overall effect is negligible considering the already overwhelming superiority of the Imperial Navy. These can be thought of as extra capital ships.   Whoop-dee-doo, considering that the Death Star needs to hit its target in real space while the Forerunner Navy can leisurely spam it with its weapons and War Sphinxs safely from the bosom of Slipspace. I don't see anything impressive about the Death Star in comparison to what the Forerunners have done, again, a miner was capable of blowing up a planet. A fleet was capable of inducing stellar collapse.   LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - http://youtu.be/Et1deUMwHB0?t=19m04s, said: However, the Galaxy Gun is a major superweapon that does have a major effect: It fires shell through hyperspace, where they drop out anywhere to destroy planets, or possibly stars. Thus, it would be able to attack and devastate UNSC worlds without every having fear of retaliation, and most importantly, voiding the only benefit the Halo Array gives by allowing the GE to attack from without the Halo Array's protected area.   The Galaxy Gun is an offensive superweapon, the Halo array is a defensive superweapon, a key and deciding difference in power. The Galaxy Gun is always available for use, whether to turn the tide or hasten a victory, while the Halo array can only be used when you are already losing to try to turn the tide.   Problem, the Galaxy Gun needs to know what and where to hit. In order to do that, the crews will need accurate star charts to destroy a planet. Consequently, they need to be able to map hyperlanes throughout the entire Milky Way galaxy and avoid pitfalls such as planets, black holes, and asteroid fields. By which time, Forerunner slipspace driver, unburdened with hyperlanes and can cross the Milky Way in hours, have already mapped the Star Wars galaxy.   Even then, there remains the possibility of a Forerunner ancilla hijacking the Galaxy Gun, like R2-D2 and cause friendly fire. Don't think the Star Wars galaxy is going to like that.   This isn't even accounting for the fact that aside from Legends the Galaxy Gun and the Maw installation never existed.   LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - http://youtu.be/Et1deUMwHB0?t=19m04s, said:  Now, as for scenarios: If the UNSC ventures forth into the GE, using everything they've got, they will be soundly defeated without significant effort on the part of the GE thanks to the overwhelming technological and numerical military fleet advantage, and the ease of Imperial logistics in fighting on their home turf.   If the GE strike first, against the UNSC, the UNSC has the option to activate the Halo Arrays to inflict a major setback on the Imperial Navy, while simultaneously inflicting major damage on their own assets. A major counterattack at this point could allow them to temporarily defend their galaxy, but if they venture forth to pursue, they will be soundly defeated once they lose the halo array support. At this point, the GE either settles in for a war of attrition, which they will win thanks to the ability to outproduce the UNSC and use the Galaxy Gun to conduct bombardment-like attacks on the UNSC without fear of retaliation, or launch a second force. At this point, the Halo array is no longer a secret, ans can be avoided by the fleets or neutralized by the Galaxy Gun, allowing the GE a rapid victory with a second push.   Thus, the Galactic Empire is many times more powerful militarily than the UNSC, or any other Halo Entity, and stands a far better chance of winning a war between the two.    Maybe so for the U.N.S.C and Covenant, which is what I conceded, but the problem for Star Wars is is that Halo has the Flood on their side.    The physical avatar of an eldricth, malevolent, and sinister 100 billion year old race that trivially brought the Forerunner's 3 million+ world strong Ecumene to their knees in the span of three centuries, simultaneously forcing them to violate their most cherished beliefs in pursuit of cure that did not exist, before finally delivering the coup de grace by activating the Star Roads and admitting to a despairing Librarian that the Domain, the Forerunner equivalent of the afterlife, and one of the few remaining primary sources detailing their culture following the activation of the Halo Arrays, would be destroyed by their very own tools.   And you know what they did at the end, before the Arrays fired?   They laughed...   The Primordial, the Last Precursor;  "Our urge to create is immutable; we must create. But the beings we create shall never again reach out in strength against us. All that is created will suffer. All will be born in suffering; endless greyness shall be their lot. All creation will tailor to failure and pain, and never again shall the offspring of the eternal Fount rise up against their creators. No more will. No more freedom. Nothing new but agonizing death and never good shall come of it. We are the last of those who gave you breath and shape and form, millions of years ago. We are the last of those your kind defied and ruthlessly destroyed. We are the last Precursors. And now we are legion."" So yeah, forerunners and halo would win because of this ^.

Within days of this 'war,' the Forerunners would have largely mapped the major and most population centers of the G.F.F.A using a combination of their own slipspace drives (which are capable of extra-galactic travel and capable of scanning the complete DNA pattern of life 14,000 light years away) and the subverted intelligence of composed species. Within weeks, Forerunner ancilla, given the sufficient time required to disseminate Star Wars' computer language and OS, will access the Holo-Net and preform such function as: mining data, ex: the locations of missing planets to add to their ever-expanding star charts, distributing propaganda promising a better future under the stipulations of surrender, all the while simultaneously hacking the Republic/Imperial/Rebel/C.I.S databases for enemy movements (considering that Forerunner slipspace drives, cable of traversing the entire Milky Way in hours, are not shackled by hyperspace lanes, response times to Star Wars invasions will be swift and brutal). Concurrently, ancilla network will likewise attempt to access the Droid computers of the C.I.S, turning their own mindless droids against their erstwhile allies.         Ground engagements against Star Wars would be slaughter-fests if the Ecumene choose to deploy their Seekers, mecha's capable of matching even Gundams in terms of sheer physics-breaking awesomeness. Instead, to slash costs and avoid over-spending on their military, the Forerunners abhorred violence as it conflicted with the Mantle, the Ecumene military will opt to use the War Sphinx, an already outdated machine at least 10,000 years old compared to it successor the Seeker.   At 10 meters by 20 meters long, the heavily outdated War Sphinx will dominate naval and terrestrial engagements against Star Wars' military. Capable of deploying and shooting down hapless AT-ATs from high orbit, while simultaneously dogfighting with T.I.E fighters and X-wings, these antiques of Forerunner military hardware will leave onlookers in awe as their weapons carve divots, canyons, and create explosive blasts visible from orbit, without optical enhancements.   A single War Sphinx was regarded as a unit with enough firepower to level continents and wipe out cities, which is rather repetitive considering Forerunner cities spannedcontinents. The worst part, besides from the fact that Seekers could chew through dozens of them, was the fact they were often used as escort duty for Forerunner ships.   Hell, the Ur-Didact wouldn't have to resort to his War Sphinxs, the approximately ~ 61,000,000,000,000,000,000 strong sentinel army that composes Onyx would double as both tools capable of engaging enemy personnel, armor, and star-fighters. What's worse is the fact that in Halo: Ghosts of Onyx, an abandoned Onyx sentinel factory had the capacity to construct one sentinel every six seconds. Assuming a minimum of 100,000 years, its actually more considering that the Shield World Initiative was proposed in 110,000 BCE, that would be the equivalent to 516 billion sentinels. Onyx Sentinels, capable of orbital interdiction, will truly show the meaning of the word 'numbers' against T.I.E fighters.    Likewise, Forerunner ground ordnance would likely be more than a match for blasters in terms of energy generation and power; fully charged boltshot rounds, a weapon designated as a side arm in the Forerunner military, were capable of incinerating fully shielded Spartan IVs, titanium armor and all; even a single shot from a Z-750 special applications sniper rifle is capable of achieving the same results even when hitting a body's extremities.   Even worse is the fact that with their hardlight constructs and precise atomic transmutation, even the most ****y of Forerunner infantry (Promethean Knights) were capable of producing support units from dirt. Literally, Halo 4's Promethean Knights army, the equivalent to a bat-****-crazy Ur-Didact building his army out of 'Forerunner legos' was capable of producing Crawlers, within seconds, from DIRT.   They are, pun intended, dirt cheap.   The Forerunner equivalent of casual wear, was capable of effectively rendering them biologically immortal. 'Dumb' ancilla subroutines were capable of regulating the decay of the Forerunner genome against biological senescence. Even lethal radioactive bursts from suns were nothing to the Forerunners, as their 'skins' were capable of regenerating damage done to Iso-Didact's DNA at the same rate harmful gamma rays were destroying them. Essentially a post-scarcity civilization, the Forerunners rendered disease extinct, as their suits were capable of isolating potentially harmful material and destroy via nano-machines.   The Forerunners were also master geneticists, the Librarian, a brilliant Life-Worker, up-lifted species left and right. I wonder what happens when they get their hands on the Jedi and begin reconstructing midi-chlorians. I shudder to think of what would happen to the Star Wars universe.   The Composer, a device designed to digitally convert organic brain patterns in a process disturbingly similar to Microsoft Word's CTRL+C followed by CTRL+V (copy-paste_ function, was designed to specifically implant a digitized mind into a new cloned body. Forerunner kill to death ratios will be astoundingly high, considering their effectively revived from the dead.   Star Wars' entrepreneurs and business men that collude with the Ecumene will be left gawking stupidly as a Forerunners miners casually mass-scatter planets 'a la Death Star style,' induce stellar collapse in one system, while conversely pumping billions of tons of Hydrogen in another star "fending off stellar collapse."   Forerunner industry grossly outclasses Star Wars by orders of magnitude, considering that conservatively, using the old canon dimensions of 160 km diameter for the Death Star II, the Onyx shield world's micro-dyson sphere, one out of thousands, required as much cubic material of volume to complete as producing a Death Star II, every five minutes non-stop for 8000 years. *This wasn't even a secret project as it was a highly publicized political battle between the Ur-Didact's Shield Worlds and Faber's Halo Arrays.*   With regards to naval warfare, even with their vaunted 'biggatons,' Star Wars has shown no way to weaponize space-time itself. Food for a thought, one of the final battles between a heavily depleted and bled Ecumene had an admiral commanding 700,000 warships. Scaling from the War Sphinx escorts conceivably has the Foreunners reaching giga-to-tera tons of power output. *For reference, the quinary or quaternary particle array guns (which the Forerunners regarded as anti-aircraft weapons) on theMantle's Approach were capable of vaporizing a fully shielded Strident Class frigates 500 m long.*   Let's add a bit more salt to that injury shall we.   Forerunner naval doctrine evolved beyond the point of just your typical sci-fi battles that consisted mainly of 'WWII in space.' For instance, the Battle at the Greater Ark involved a battlezone 6 million kilometers in diameter, its safe to say Star Wars is hopelessly outranged, and this is under the assumptions that the Forerunners would be willing to come out of slipspace. Strategically, all the Forerunner navy would have to do is sit in slipspace and nuke the hell out of any Star Wars fleet daring to challenge them with impunity and sustain virtually no casualties except for maybe cleanup operations and boarding actions.   Even then casualties sustained when boarding are dubious at best, as Forerunner suppressors were capable of disabling technology, ancilla, and even neurological activity throughout an entire ship.   Should the Forerunners want to 'fight like men,' several classes of Forerunner vessels possessed  esoteric technology ranging from bafflers, capable of locally warping space-time, thereby bypassing turbolaser firepower, dazzlers used to create false sensor readings, and even remotely generate slipspace rifts capable of bifurcating even a 29 km supercarrier in Halo: Reach.   Yeah, Forerunners are beyond the capabilities of the Empire to handle. The only civilizations that beat them are ones that possess more hax than they do, and there aren't alot.

Not arguing this point per-say, but by this line of reasoning, vehicles like the Hellcat and other 'glass cannon' TDs should presumably resist 122 mm rounds from the KV-1s. Armor and ballistics technology do not always scale together.   LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - 19:04, said: As Forerunner anti-ship hardlight weapons are not 3500000 times more powerful than UNSC MACs, as they do not instantly vaporize the ships on impact, (when the energy of an impact is sufficiently massive, even if it is not heat based, the effects of the impact and spalling particles still results in effective vaporization), the comparison still stands, with the basic Imperial ship being far superior to the ships of Halo.    Do you perhaps have proof that Forerunner hardlight shields can’t resist Star Wars weapons, seeing as your ‘3,500,000 times more powerful’ claim has been debunked due to Disney revoking the I.C.S’s status as canon sources.   LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - 19:04, said: Now we can note that the Forerunners are/were technologically inferior to the GE, and by most reckoning, numerically inferior as well, and all the current Halo races are inferior to the Forerunners in numbers and technology, the GE thus holds a decisive advantage in any military confrontation.      I assume you haven't read Halo: Cryptum, Halo: Primordium, or Halo Silentium? Well then, let me enlighten you on how a battle between the Forerunner Ecumene and the Galactic Empire and for that matter, all the factions of Star Wars will play out.   I said just now: The aftermath of a 'war' (if we can call it that), between the G.F.F.A and the Forerunner Ecumene will have the Ur-Didact and his Prometheans left slightly out of the breath, with the Forerunner's Bureau of Economic Analysis charting a barely noticeable peak and trough in G.D.P, correlating to the start and end of this 'war.'   By the end of this 'war,' should the Ecumene Council feel rather merciful, any Star Wars species raising the white flag of surrender will be stripped of their hyperdrives and deported to their original homeworld; there, they will remain quarantined until such time that the Council deems them fit to live in cooperation with the Mantle. Any race desiring to fight to the bitter, but inevitable, end, will suffer the consequences of defying the Mantle.   Formerly important delegates of these defiant species will be composed, and will find their 'glorious' race forcibly having their D.N.A devolved back by millions of years. In the end, what little art and culture left of a once 'space-faring' race will degrade into cave art. The devolved race will be left stranded on their homeworld to endure the ponderously slow and painful process of evolution once more.   However, tyrannical despots like Palpatine and Tarkin will be tried for the 'highest contempt against the Mantle and life itself,' and will be executed, provided that the Ur-Didact's suppressors haven't shut-off their brains already.   The situation of said 'war' (more like a gnat vs. an elephant) between the Ecumene and Star Wars would be much like the situation regarding Japan and the U.S during World War II. Daring to attack a 'sleeping giant' is a recipe for defeat.   Spoiler  Even Star Wars best feats, such as using the now non-canon Incredible Cross Sections yields, upper-quartile force feats for Jedi and Sith, and simultaneously using all the Galactic Empire's super-weapons (the Galaxy Gun, World Devastators, Death Star I/II, etc. will result in the Ecumene sustaining a bloody nose and a black eye.

You underestimate halo waaaay too much... The forerunner empire us bigger than sw alone... I can't be assed to sum up the forerunners, but this guy does it pretty well. I took this from a forum a while back: " I don't have the Halo Encyclopedia, but both the Halopeida page and Halo Wiki page give the MAC cannon on a frigate as firing 600 ton (544311kg) slugs at 30000m/s.     As the MAC shells have no bursting charge, their entire destructive energy is in their kinetic energy: 1/2mv^2. 1/2 * 544311kg * 30000m/s * 30000m/s =2.4*10^14 J.   The problem with using your numbers is that I have another source that is just as equally valid with regards to M.A.C yields. In fact, multiple editions of theHalo: Encyclopedia describes a 600 ton M.A.C round accelerating to velocities of point four-tenths c*. Finding a consistent yield that most people can agree on is ... difficult to say the least.   Using Einstein's formula for relating energy and mass at relativistic velocities and using a conversion factor of long tons to kilograms, approximately (1::1000). You used short tons by the way. One has yields of: 1.17 Teratons of TNT (v = .4c)10.34 Gigatons of TNT (v = .04c)64.53 Kilotons of TNT (v = .0001c) Spoiler (*) Whether or not you choose to believe that 'point four-tenths' the speed of c is either implies 40% or 4% light speed is entirely up to you, and I kid you not when I tell you that entire threads and quasi-thesis length posts have been created by nerds 'anally' analyzing the semantics of what the encyclopedia 'meant when it says 'point four-tenths' and why the above velocities are more 'canonically accurate' than 30000 m/s. Simply put Spoiler  The M.A.C yield debates are quite figuratively deader and beaten more than the 'horses' that are already beat here on the WOT forums. Really, at this point it’s just a ****storm many sci-fi vs. debaters refuse to open, so most, including me, opt to pick the more 'reasonable yields' of 64.53 kilotons for shipboard M.A.Cs and 51.63 gigatons for shipboard M.A.Cs, with yields like 1.17 teratons (which fits rather nicely to both John-117's Spartan identification number and 343i/Bungie's continued references to the number 7 does it not?) for frigates and 9 teraton for S.M.A.Cs being relegated for 'max-wank' or 'composite universe' threads.   Covenant naval ordnance, thankfully, does not share as much of the contradictions their human counterparts possess. Most people calculated that Covenant plasma torpedoes rank in the mid-megatons to mid-gigaton range in terms of yields. [Plasma torpedoes and other showings of Covenant naval ordnance are actually quite consistent compared to their human counterparts, considering plasma torpedoes that miss by several meters from U.N.S.C ships are consistently capable of boiling through meters of titanium armor almost instantly through radiation emission.]   Do you see the problem?   All these sources, the Halo: Encyclopedia, The Fall of Reach, Halo Reach, and Halo 3 are all equally canon in the eyes of 343 Industries.   Meaning that finding a yield is a matter of personal bias and a M.A.C debates becomes a **-fest of 'nuh-uh' and 'uh-huh' until a mod comes and nukes the thread.  To put it succinctly, Halo's expanded universe currently suffers the same problem that formerly plagued Star Wars now none-existent EU, massive contradictions and internal inconsistencies, which is why discerning a consistent yield for M.A.C rounds is a colossal hurdle without the company’s declarations of what is and what isn't canon. Also, not to nitpick, but at that sort of velocity, you enter the realm of special relativity; consequently, it’s more accurate to apply Einstein's formula of Kinetic energy at relativistic speeds. Though, being that the derived energy equivalence is so high, it honestly shouldn't matter using the general definition of kinetic energy.  LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - 19:04, said: The bombs dropped on Hiroshima and Nagasaki have a yield around 7.5*10^13J.   The most commonly accepted yield is 15 kilotons of TNT.   LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - 19:04, said: The MAC is the standard weapon of UNSC starships, so we will compare this to the standard weapon of Galactic Empire starships, the Turbolaser. Obviously, a Turbolaser is not a laser, as it fires bolts and the guns have visible openings, not lenses. The mechanics of the operations of turbolasers are semantics, though the theory sourced from Stardestroyer.net seems to be that they are discrete pulses of mass-less particles moving in a helical pattern at the speed of light.   However we can note that Light Turbolasers, used for point defense and attacking fighters, have a yield between 2.5*10^15 and 3.1*10^16J, already greater than or equal to the main weapon on UNSC ships.   Heavy turbolaser batteries used as the primary weapon for ship-ship combat have a listed yield of 8.4*10^20 J, almost 3500000 times more powerful than the primary cannon on a UNSC warship.   If blasters operate at the speed of light, we wouldn't be able to see them and people that dodge them in the movies or TV shows no?    Otherwise, Star Wars would be a helluva a lot more boring if soldiers and rebels pew-pew'd each other and the guy he/she aimed at dropped dead near-instantaneously. Also, I can't seem to find the numbers you posted, for light turbolasers, as the first two hyperlinks in your post were invalid URLs for me.   Can you confirm that those values were derived from solely the movies and the Star Wars the Clone Wars TV series? 200 gigaton heavy turbolasers and, for that matter, everything inside Curtis Saxton's Incredible Cross Sections, are no longer canon, as per Disney's new canon policy.   As of now, the I.C.S can only show up if and only if the OP specifies Legends canon, i.e. the old Star Wars Expanded Universe. LordCommanderMilitant, on Jun 02 2014 - 19:04, said: Now, we can note that warships of both universes can withstand salvoes from their own main guns, so their armor and shielding must scale accordingly. Thus, armoring and shielding on a Imperial Star Destroyer is far more effective than on UNSC or Covenant warships.[/quote]

It is a parasitic organism

Not the Vong.