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Destiny

Discuss all things Destiny.
Edited by Kallisto: 7/12/2014 10:19:53 PM
15

This game is DEEP (High Lvl pvp ≠ Low Lvl pvp)

[b][u]WARNING:[/u] SPECULATION AND OPINIONS AHEAD[/b] As the title says, it seems that high level play will be vastly different and more complicated than low level play. Destiny takes all the basic elements of competitive shooters and adds layers of "character" depth that we traditionally only see in fighters and MOBAs. Consider exotic weapons and armor. We don't know a whole lot about them yet, but from what we [i]have[/i] seen we can tell they are each going to be truly unique pieces of gear. They are not just 'better than' or 'more powerful than' the sub-exotic weapons but have unique properties. This is gear that changes the way you play and are played against, often granting its user, for example, the ability to cloak when scoped in and the ability to acquire ammo by shooting ammo crates (see Closing Time). These kinds of abilities change everything. I'll come back to this. There are also class abilities like, for example, the Hunter's 'Blink' ability. This adds a whole layer of complexity to each encounter knowing that your opponent could Blink out of range of your Super or right up into your face with his shotgun. These kinds of game-changing abilities will only become more and more prevalent as players progress. In other words, PvP at high levels is going to be very different than PvP at low levels much like in an MMO where players have fewer abilities at their disposal at lower levels than high levels. You'll still have to know the maps and be able to hit your shots, of course, but you'll also have to be ready for your enemy to pull a ground slide, a blink or triple jump, a super, or receive a health boost after getting a kill to name just a few of the myriad of options we'll have at our disposal at high levels. Things are going to get pretty hectic. You could even argue that it might go a little overboard, but I want to give people the benefit of the doubt and say it's possible that the FPS scene is ready to turn their brains on again and have to think while they're playing competitive multiplayer. However, striking a balance between those with the abilities granted from the exceedingly rare exotic gear and those without them is a worrisome thought. I hope Bungie has concocted a remedy for this situation. It would not be healthy for the game if, for example, Closing Time or Read Death were so unique that they were [i]the[/i] sniper or [i]the[/i] rifle if you really wanted to compete with the 'big dawgs'. It would also make sense and, in my opinion, improve the competitive experience to know what kinds of abilities you're up against before a PvP match starts. That way you know to, for example, avoid close quarters with this person wearing this armor because melee kills grant them a health boost and half of their 'super' meter or whatever it might be. Or, say, knowing that there are two people on the opposing team with the ability to cloak. That's vital information that can be extremely punishing to just have to learn the hard way each and every match. It makes for a better, more compelling multiplayer experience when there's no room for cheap tricks. Think of how the MOBAs do the pregame. Everyone can see who they're meeting on the battlefield as well as whatever special abilities they've chosen. This is how it should be done in Destiny, where abilities granted from gear combined with a certain class build could almost be thought of as a "character" like in a MOBA or fighting game. It is simply vital information to know what you're up against when there are so many dynamically different possibilities. Hopefully Bungie has integrated some sort of way to display this information while the pre-game animations are happening. At the lower level of play that we've seen thus far there isn't a lot of variation from player to player so maybe something like this has already been implemented but simply wasn't relevant in the ALPHA. I'm pumped guys. I didn't think I could get excited about an FPS anymore, but alas, it seems this game could really be something special. Time will tell. Thanks for reading. Please share your thoughts and comments.

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  • A well written and thought out post, unlike many others on this forum. You have many great points, witch I haven't even begun to think about yet. I hope though, the same as you, that our guys at bungie has. I like how you present the different ways weapons and armor fully upgraded may provide us with different play styles. It's making me look forward to the final build of the game even more. I think that bungie has balanced these things pretty evenly, but shouldn't you have access to different things I you play a game 5 hrs a day vs 1. timer? If you at the best fps player in the world you're still gonna win, but you have advantages as a regular player... Again, great post. Even more stoked for the game now.

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  • I think Bungie takes a lot of pride in their Multiplayer gaming and it will be a work in progress and will improve and become more balanced over time. Not everyone will be happy with the Crucible as with every multiplayer competitive game but I'm looking forward to it. P.S. I already hate the shotgun (I still remember it from halo).

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  • Sorry, but that sounds like a horrible idea. There's only 3 classes, shouldn't be too hard to learn the classes and prepare for their different builds. You see a hunter, and you know they can either pick you off from range with golden gun, or mess your shit up close with the arc blade. Just like you don't know if a guardian is going to come through the door or use their movement ability to jump through the window, you shouldn't know your enemies build before you face them.

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  • It's a little deeper than what you mentioned. I don't have a problem with having an option to view other players equipment before a match. However....don't forget that you can swap out equipment any time. Even during a match. This will change things up and could also be used to mislead you.

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  • Edited by Ian Mackay: 7/13/2014 3:22:36 AM
    I agree, the skills/abilities should add a considerable amount of depth to even mid tier/level game play. I don't think that gear will be as big of a force, as I believe I heard on some alpha streams that the game "normalizes" the damage of all weapons to ensure a rare/exotic isn't OP. That said, choices of weapon types will IMO be the most important, and will vary with each game type/map and player role.

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    • Edited by Mandingo: 7/13/2014 3:28:00 AM
      Only thing I am concern about the PvP are those lag kills, if it's gonna be the same story like the Alpha... ugh! Lag kills just sucks

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    • From the Aplha gameplay (subject to change), combat is very brief, more brief than Halo. Much of the game is tactical. Movement, health management, verticality, Map control (the arena pvp we all know and love). Basically, the builds wont matter as much in pvp with exception to the skills that help keep players on the move. Moves like the Titan's shoulder charge will make or brake the balance of pvp. For a closer look of things to come, here is a skill calendar of the ahlpa build. http://www.destinytheguide.com/loadouts.html

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      • Interesting read. You make some great points. Seems Destiny has the potential to make waves in the pro-circuit. Although, the game is surely going to change a WHOLE lot in the next 10 years. That still blows my mind. I mean, WoW's turning 10. WoW!!

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        • I disagree. No one should be able to see what im packing. Go on with your head on straight and it shouldn't really be an issue for you. I don't what you to know i have a shield bubble until it's to late.

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          • [quote] ability to cloak when scoped in [/quote] Yeah, but if you're sniping right [being a Hunter] you're always cloaked. Either way, I think this is a bad idea. You should be paying attention, rather than having the game tell you everything.

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            • they balance this by making them all unique in appearance, it will should force you to learn what people have by recognizing the visual style of the exotics and different armor types, also trial and error. no advanced data other than class and subclass. otherwise all in game inspections / playing the game to find out

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            • You realize gearing is going to be balanced in pvp? There is not going to be such a thing as high and low pvp...The only difference is going to be if a weapon has certain special stats.

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              • I REALLY hope that exotics aren't THE weapons. I hope that there are multiple exotics for each weapon type.

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              • GuardianDude, you bring up some great points in speculation! What you argued makes sense to me, but I have to believe that Bungie has something in place to even the battle fields. I'd like to think that equalizer is like what you described in pre-match info. This doesn't seem the type of thing we'll find the answer to in the Beta,. And will probably have to wait until the full launch. Keep us posted if you unfurl any new info! O.o,y,,

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              • how long did that take to type?

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