LOL So you're blaming the victims? Hitler also killed gays, Egyptians (gypsies), people who opposed his political views, people who hated his art, as well as the Jews. The Jews weren't the only victims buddy.

[quote]Hitler[/quote] Jews have been persecuted by almost everybody everywhere. Hitler isn't the only one.

I don't want to go all the way back to the pharaohs and make an essay on all the people who persecuted the Jews. I just made the Hitler statement because it just shows that people kill because they can, not just because of religion, getting rid of religion won't stop suffering from occurring on this planet.

[quote]I don't want to go all the way back to the pharaohs and make an essay on all the people who persecuted the Jews.[/quote] And the Brits. And the Russians. And who can forget the Arabs. [quote]I just made the Hitler statement because it just shows that people kill because they can, not just because of religion, getting rid of religion won't stop suffering from occurring on this planet.[/quote] This argument is as irrelevant as when people say "getting rid of guns won't stop people from killing each other". Obviously. The point is it would cause LESS suffering, death, and oppression. If you try and deny that people kill and oppress each other over religion (especially in the Middle East), then you aren't being realistic. Whatever, I'm not going to start this again with you because the only point you try to make is that not all religious people kill each other when that isn't the subject and it's a fact no sane person disputes.

I don't remember saying it was their fault they got killed; probably because I never said that. And I wasn't taking about just the holocaust, anti semitism was prevalent throughout Europe for hundreds of years, their persecution wasn't limited to to the 1940's.

Yeah but you said "If the Jewish religion wasn't around, they wouldn't have suffered". How about you say if it weren't for all the assholes persecuting them, they wouldn't have suffered? I'd rather live in a world without assholes.

The thread isn't asking what asshole you could erase from history. Making obvious conclusions isn't victim blaming. Could an individual be our persecuted for being in a demographic if it doesn't exist? The answer is obviously no. It's the same for any other situation. Would a certain person have been murdered if they weren't at the place they were killed? No; does that mean that person is at fault for being killed? Of course not. It's not victim blaming, it's simple logic. Past actions influence future actions; one event can't happen if the previous one did not.