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Edited by AAAAAA:
3/15/2013 10:27:34 PM
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I can't be the only one thinking that discussion is "dead".
Dead may be an over statement. However, I believe we can all see that there is far less actual discussion going on, on these forums. In the pre-b.next days, it would not be uncommon to have a consistent number of 3-5 100+ post threads in the off-topic (formerly flood) with a ranging level of discussion, however they did have a discussion with people constantly quoting eachother and making arguments for and against different points. We saw nonstop debate about anything from Games to Pets to Consoles to Politics (when a blind-eye was turned), often culminating in massive threads and heated debate about a particular point. Sure, much discussion was of low quality; however it was at least there, it provided us with somewhere to easily post what we wanted and get responses/discussion/feedback/awareness on/about it.
It's clear there has been a conscious decision to change away from the traditionalist forum-style discussion method towards a more social, less content heavy type of discussion forum. One good example of this is the removal of the post Timers/Limits, these often would force you to type a proper sentence/paragraph rather than typing a 3 word meme answer that contributed little, another example would be the introduction of 'likes' that essentially upvote a post to the main 'popular' page. I believe this has been done in order to increase the usage of Bungie.net from the 'new' generation of gamers, one focussed on quick social status updates, fast responses and one liner memes. However, doing this has simply killed the vast majority of decent quality discussion as people simply don't want to reply to one-another as their comment will be hidden from view to most of the public and has led to reponses being almost entirely directed at the OP; essentially killing any opportunity for development inside of a thread from the original point; a key feature of any decent non-sticky thread.
The lack of any form of discussion is driving older community members away from posting on this website. I cannot be the only one who thinks this.
Maybe I'm just a jaded fool ranting instead of working, however to me the effects of .next are clear.
How about you? Spending less time here? Contributing less to threads? What can be done?
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Edited by DEZARATH: 6/10/2013 1:17:15 PMI've made some contributes and tried to touch on some interesting points and ideas for gameplay. But you can only go so far with the information you have. In due time this forum will be drowned in posts and most likely a lot of the regulars you've seen in the Destiny forum will vanish under the tide of excitement. I try to follow posters who I respect to others out of courtesy for their follows, humor, or wit. I'd say if you see someone taking the time to respond in complete sentences with structured thought to follow them. They are gems in a sea of the faceless.
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Edited by Prometheus25: 3/18/2013 9:32:19 PMI disagree with a couple points here. To begin, your assessment that the new style of foruming encourages "3 word meme answer[s]" is something I disagree with on all accounts. In all of my eight years here, I have seen very little change in these sort of posts and they have persisted through the new forum transition. More on this point, the removal of the forum time limit does not, nor did it, have an impact on a poster's content. Anyone willing to post a short, "worthless" blurb for comment was not hindered, as the post limit only affected frequency, and not length, of posts. Short posts and frequent posts are mutually exclusive and do not come hand in hand. Honestly, I think there has been very small amounts of critically useful discussion on this site (with a few exceptions) in quite some time. It is my opinion, however, that this is a result of two things. Pre-b.next, there wasn't much to talk about. During the darkness, every facet of every topic was practically scrapped clean, especially here in the community forum. There was simply nothing new coming from Bungie to truly fuel the furnaces of conversation. Post-b.next is a different story entirely. While the available content has increased, I believe that the new pageless and bottom-up post order has changed how people respond to threads. It was vastly common knowledge that many users simply read the OP of a thread, perhaps a few posts, then used the "respond" button to add their thoughts, skipping dozens of posts - and often pages - that may have already stated the same ideas that the user wanted to express. In many instances, conversations would periodically repeat themselves as new users came and left a thread, pushing older conversations into seldom-read pages allowing the new users to state the same ideas and rebuttals that were well-expressed and rebuked. The new style lets the most recent and often more relevant posts float to the top where users can easily read them, a simple method that allows pertinent, popular, and useful ideas to be easily communicated and shared without the inherent repetition that plagued the threads and forum as a whole. With shared ideas being more easily expressed and less often repeated, we are seeing shorter threads, simply for the fact that the same posts aren't being repeated ad nauseum as the pages tick past. To some it may look like there's less discussion, but really there's simply less noise.
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1 ReplyI'm in the wait&see category. In my honest opinion, too, I still feel we're in the "dark" until the E3 reveal. The announce and quick talks drive some activity, but the real draw to a game forum is an actual game for the community to rally behind. While many of the older members have ditched the site to deal with school, work, life... I have no doubt they'll be back at some point. Gaming as a whole has been in a slump for some time, as the consoles had become somewhat stale. The next gen will breathe life into this ship, and we'll sail into the stars.
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Yeah. Basically either you have no discussions now, or any discussion is only between two people- or at least everybody is replying to one person so each discussion THAT person is having is between two people. It's definitely a shame, but I don't think Bungie is going to change anything about the sub-threads now that they're this far in, unfortunately. :(
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June 10th, 2013.
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1 ReplyI just thought the forum was full of immature 12-16 year olds. I can't count the number of repeat threads/polls (e.g. Which Class Will You Pick?) I've seen in just a couple weeks of being here. I tried posting some good threads that I'd hope would spark some good discussions, but they were buried in minutes by repeat threads/polls. Also, I can't even describe the threads full of crazy ideas where every word is misspelled and the grammatical structure betrays the age of the OP- "Dun u think itd be soooo cool if u could liek betray N backstab other peeps?!" I still lurk and troll now with obscure references to movies and games none of these people have seen or played.
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Its more likely the new reply system. Unless you actually click the reply button to see extra responses then you will never know. I find myself engaging in less conversations because they are generally hidden.
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4 Repliesahhhhhh the irony is just too much, I know it's just my browser messing up but you have to appreciate the beautiful moment I had there, and that I am now sharing that beautiful moment with all of you.
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1 ReplyThere is no .next or .old there is only the .net. Bungie.net Is Bungie.net regardless of what face you put over it. The interface is simply new. All it needs is the return to chronological post order. Other than that I am very satisfied with the site update.
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1 ReplyYes, I contribute less. Yes, it's because I feel user interaction has been cheapened. Yes, it's also because comments are hidden and chained in an unintuitive way. Yes, Bungie.next is a very poor user experience in my opinion.
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I hear ya.
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Discussion isn't dead. It's just... missing in action.
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1 ReplyEdited by Baby Wrinkles: 3/18/2013 4:13:39 PMI'm spending [i]more[/i] time here, but only because I didn't really spend any time here before (and am now thoroughly regretting it). I have a hard time with the new layout. Reverse chronological posting has been an option on most boards I frequent, but never the default - and it's confusing. I can see the value in giving new comments a voice, rather than "Oh, I didn't get to post in the first page before this thread became popular, might as well not post at all." However, that lends itself best to the short-attention-span demographic that's 'up and coming.' [EDIT: I should note here; Bungie is a business. In the long run, catering to this demographic insures it's ongoing success. Doesn't mean I like it, but them's dollar bills.] Mind you: that's only one element of the many things you touched on, but I think it's one of the bigger ones. I hope Bungie recognizes the need for some tweaking, and can bring these forums to a 'happy medium.' As those of us (yourself included I'm sure) who have been around technology for a while know, things are always changing, and clinging to the old is a great way to become obsolete. This new layout just seems to have gone thermonuclear on the old, ignoring that it ever existed, rather than adding newer elements (some of the tagging, following, like/dislike buttons for instance) to a more 'traditional' forum layout. Give the new kids something to play with that suits their "SQUIRREL!" mentality while letting those of us who care for more deep discussion continue to have it in a more familiar format.
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Just wait.
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Edited by duck: 3/16/2013 6:24:53 AMBungie.net has always had its highs and lows in population. Some who know of this are optimistic and assume this is a very low period that will pass. They ignore the fact that bungie has made official trailers and announcements of their new game, Destiny, and the fact that the Destiny forum gets posts not in 'x posts per minute', but 'x minutes per post'. The other forums get posts every few hours, and frankly anyone familiar with the private group feature on this site knows that this update was anything but an improvement. I myself think this is a wonderful experience in terms of experimentation. In many threads I debated how terrible things would be if Bungie.net had features such as likes, followers, ignore, and popularity sorting; yet my arguments were all hypothetical. To see here it put to the test in raw reality, and to see my points validated, is very insightful.
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I think that, as people increase in familiarity with the new layout and members, the old zealousness and community will return. Right now our family is going through a change and inviting new members in. As the excitement around destiny increases, the discussions on b.net become more and more fragmented. I expect the new community to reach its full potential a couple months after destiny's release.
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1 ReplyI'm certainly spending less time here as all of my private groups seem to have dried up, but that doesn't mean people aren't still talking in the mains. Even if there isn't exactly the same numbers of people as before, I can still have a good time here like I used to.
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I don't really recall there ever being a time when there was an abundance of intelligent, levelled discussion. This is the Internet, after all, but I do know what you mean. Despite all the hubbub about Destiny, I'm spending much less time on these forums, partially because, quite frankly, there is no weekly update yet. That, and these forums no longer feel unique. It doesn't feely nearly as "homey" as it did before.
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2 RepliesThere feels like a lack of intelligent discussion. (Though I don't look very hard for it.) I notice a lot more of the "news" or opinion threads now (forum trash). Kinda banking on the tag muting to come around shortly.
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4 RepliesTags altered in order to put this in front of the people who need/want to see it. #complainingabouttagsandthenmisusingthemiscounterproductiveandselffulfulling
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It's the nested replies and the post order. If they'd just fix it, it'd solve a lot of the problem. But hey, I'm just repeating what the angry crowds have been yelling for two months now, what do I know.
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Discussion isn't dead. I just had a 200+ post thread just a week or so ago.
