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Edited by Zodleon:
1/25/2024 12:39:16 AM
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Why Adept weapons?
This is asked mostly as a trials player who sees most "fix trials by giving easier adepts" posts. I want to know why you are so fixated on adepts when the reg versions are nearly as good. What is the difference to you, really?
Anyone else who feels they have insight is free to weigh in, of course
Edit: to clarify my question here is mostly directed at the ppl who think that easier/free adepts is the magic bullet that'll "save" trials. Not why ppl want adepts generally, as that's pretty obvious.
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Honesty, from me a person who is not interested in adept trials weapons The adepts from trials are overhyped Coming from someone who has done vog master (which I do find more worth cause of the locked rolls) I hate how your effort can lead to rewards being worse then a regular god roll Plus I just really don’t find the idea of pvp stuff being treated as such, not cause of of jealousy or anything, it’s honestly just makes the game mode less appealing to me, since imagine being told “hey see that gun you have, look at this ADEPT version of it” meaning your effort feels worse and useless, but this could just be a me issue
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3 RepliesFor me I want the shader that comes on the adept. Other than that I have some nice damn rolls on the regular version of weapons.
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because most destiny players want everything handed to them. They don't want to grind and get better.
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Edited by NotCreative123: 1/26/2024 10:19:18 PMPlayers want to feel rewarded for their time. With Trials, you feel like you accomplished something when you go Flawless. The Adept weapons represent going Flawless. It's not about how good or bad the Adept weapon is (though, in some cases, it is better due to the mods), it's about players feeling rewarded for their time. Although you didn't ask, my recommendation is to change Trials from an either / or system to a tiered system. You achieve different Flawless tiers by winning a certain number of games in a row, 3, 5, 7, and 9 wins. You could give the Adept weapon at 5 wins, and then include additional perks at 7 and 9. The details don't really matter - the point is that this method solves the issue with Trials: That ALL players need to feel rewarded (and it doesn't compromise on the goal of Trials, which is to reward "skill")
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Because people don’t want to use an inferior product when a superior one exists. Players that make this claim about wanting easier/free adepts due to better players. Better players have adept weapons so they create this fallacy that they died not due to their lack of skill but because said weapon is adept therefore better and that is what they use to justify said death.
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7 RepliesThe ONLY reason people want the adepts is for the flex. Every other excuse is a lie.
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Its weird. Adepts dont really do much. But if you are looking to min-max yes, Adepts go a long way. But if your casual there is absolutely nothing wrong with regular weapons as long as you stay up on build crafting.
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It is slightly better and because of that, people want it just handed to them. The idea that doing really well at the game should reward the best items is not comprehensible to them.
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I think adpets are much harder to get from trials than GMS or master raids and should be made more accessible in trials to match. But it would be naive to think that's what would save trials. Its very frustrating to lose a million matches in a row. Someone who has never gone flawless shouldn't be facing someone who has it gilded every season. These needs to be some level of skill based matchmaking or some other mechanic to prevent matchups where one team would be lucky to even get a kill between them. Rep gains start out slow and cap very low. Even if double XP weeks it takes like 5 matches to get enough rounds won to get a non-negligable amount of XP from a match and even when I have the 20 wins it still feels slower than a regular week in strikes, crucible, or gambit. There needs to be at least 100 XP from every loss (100 games to reset) and a max of maybe 400 XP from a match won with 20 rounds on the card (25 wins for a reset) I don't care about the loot that drops at the end of a match most of the time. Armor stats aren't great and a lot of the weapons aren't copies of the one I'm trying to farm. To solve this problem reward structure could be. Losses have a 50% chance to drop a random weapon with a 25% chance to have double perks in column 2 and a 20% chance to drop a focusable engram. Wins will always drop a weapon or armor piece with at least 63 stats and a rotating weekly focus on a specific stat. Weapons have a 33% chance in each of their columns to have double perks. Wins also have a 50% chance to drop a focusable engram. Now for adepts... Completing any card unlocks a new one: Passage of Progress. This card can be completed once per week and requires 14 wins to complete. It will reward the weekly adept when completed and unlock adept focusing for the week (still requires 7 win card) adepts from any source will always roll with 2 perks in both columns. As the final reward for the second reset of a season you will be able to complete a one time additional passage of progress. No matter how anyone feels about it, the health of trials will always be tied to how willing people are to be fodder. If people are getting stomped and not getting enough rewards they will leave and find another gun that works in their build. If people are rewarded and anyone can farm adepts (even if it takes a very long time to get 14 wins) they will stay in the playlist and naturally improve the longer they're in there.
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Edited by Guardian,Archon Of Light: 1/25/2024 12:12:38 AMI know right Saint hands out Trials armor and weapons like candy , especially on double xp weekend Compare that to the dark ages when you had to make a suicide pact with 2 lfgs just to get 3 rolls a weekend, that's how I got my Outlaw/Desperado messenger People always want more , if they got adepts on a non-flawless card, they would complain they only got one If we had 10 mercies , they would still complain
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Participation trophy generation. They want stuff, so they turn their want into a need, and then they "feel," like they deserve it just because they want it. It's hilarious. Sad, pathetic, but funny in a way.
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It’s a similar mentality as valuing a gilded title over a none gilded title. In “real world” application they are not necessarily better than the regular version but because there is a “ultimate” version anything below that is automatically devalued.
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1 Reply2 perks in the last column, and adept mod options. But I don’t think any material difference at all. Color is different may be ?
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1 ReplyYou said it yourself.... nearly.
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Edited by A_mo: 1/24/2024 11:39:28 PMI couldn't really care less, as long as giving adept weapons made it so the gameplay was more natural. As far as other people, the evidence is there that people simply do not accept being given anything less than basically the same as people that know what they're doing. So instead of turning the game inside out to give people adepts it should just give them to people in a logical way that actually works the way peoples' brains are working. Then you end up with less surprises.
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1 ReplyI have every adept Trials weapon. I also have several normal versions of those weapons that are actually better than the adept versions. Adepts get a tiny bit better stats (usually, not always), and Adept Mods are awesome. That said, none of them are game-breakingly better, certainly not better enough for me to pay for them, cheat to get them, or think I'm special for having them. I actually often go out of my way to NOT use my Trials armor or emblems in crucible because people love to Tbag the hunter with the glowing Trials armor, lol.
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1 Reply1) The game encourages a collector/completionist/min-max mindset, yet the playerbase is overwhelmingly too casual to see this through. Players want every cool trophy and tool without effort. 2) Envy. Players see others with these exclusive weapons and want them too. 3) Denial. Better players have adept weapons, better players use adept weapons, and so adept weapons must make better players, right? There are many players in this game who will complain about anything they don’t have so as to excuse themself from reflecting on their own shortcomings. They deny that they can get better gradually by practice and instead want these super overpowered weapons to instantly fix their problems (which they won’t get either way since adepts aren’t even that much better and are only better if the rolls are identical and still it depends on the exact weapon). It’s easier to think “get this weapon and I’ll start getting 2.0 KDs every game” than it is to improve organically. 4) Spite. Some people don’t like Trials or Crucible in general. The idea of “having” to play AND succeed in Trials for something they want angers them and makes them lash out at the people who enjoy and support Crucible as they’re seen as the reason why Bungie keeps putting time in these modes they don’t like. They want to either take away the loot incentive for these players they see as “ostracizing” them or have access to the loot themself more easily so they can stop feeling bad. 5) Loot incentive. Players think simply giving access to an adept weapon here and there will fix Trials for them (it won’t). I think this is a fundamental misunderstanding of what an Adept weapon is, as it really isn’t that much better than a standard drop (arguably worse than one given how much easier getting a standard drop with a better roll is). Fix the loot incentive of Trials by giving more rep and post match drops even for flawed cards or losses: simple, no free Adept required. Some of these are fairly harmless/understandable whereas others are malicious and/or immature. People will naturally have much more nuanced combinations of these reasons and probably other smaller reasons, but these are the main ones I can think of.
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3 RepliesAdept mods, specifically big ones spec. I'd rather have that mod over more than half of the enhanced perks that are only a stat boost at best. They could easily make trials adepts more accessible and make it feel rewarding to go to the lighthouse, for example, when buying a ticket a person can choose a weapon that isn't in rotation to be an extra drop, artifice armor, flawless specific armor ornaments/glows. The playlist is full of 1 perceters or (rarely) cheaters who have gone flawless like 10 times that week. I know this will get hit with the GeT gOoD comment but like, it's a game...
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6 RepliesThe same people who say adept weapons aren't that much better than the regular weapons, are the same people who said not forgotten isn't much better than Lunas howl
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The reality is they don’t know the difference because of a gap in there brain They just see adept better I deserves that for free and complain about it
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6 RepliesAdept mods, but I'd rather all mods get buffed to adept levels instead of adept weapons being rewarded for failure.
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Mainly for the flex. Being 2% better. And for the adept mods. Alittle extra bit in weapon stats helps.
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3 RepliesEdited by Vijil: 1/24/2024 4:59:15 PMBecause this is a looter shooter and people will always chase the best things, even if that difference is minimal. That's what minmaxers do. These are the only items in the game that are truly locked behind a variable skill wall and not just a time sink where the encounter is the same every time and can be learned. The time required to learn how to PvP effectively in general, especially in a trial setting, is much greater than the time it takes to learn how to do a grand master encounter. People are just trying to find a way to lower the time investment required and at the same time trying to help you get a healthier pool of players. I always think it's funny when the trials players don't want more people in trials. Okay... If you know that there's not a huge difference between adepts and non adepts then why are you holding on to them so tightly? I agree. I don't think there's major difference between the two and as a result could really care less about adepts. But as a PVP main, I think it's too bad that there's not a healthier pool of players in a game mode that could be fun but isn't. That's pretty true of all crucible right now though. No incentive and not enough players.
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1 ReplyAdept weapons are just a tad bit better, as the name implies. Don't get me wrong, I love my Inquisitor with opening shot and perpetually motion, but I can't outduel an adept drop. Those extra stability, handling and range stats really boost the feel of the weapon. As for other guns it's the same. BUT don't misunderstand me. The regular weapons are still AMAZING I love almost all the weapon I have non adept
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1 ReplyAdepts are the reason I don’t play any trials. Just the thought of getting obessed with getting them when my rng is the worst in the game, along with my lack of pvp skill + depression andd anxiety… all this together convinces me trials is too much of a liability to attempt, which is why my record is 0 for lifetime.
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Edited by Bore: 1/24/2024 6:53:54 PM[quote]This is asked mostly as a trials player who sees most "fix trials by giving easier adepts" posts. I want to know why you are so fixated on adepts when the reg versions are nearly as good. What is the difference to you, really? Anyone else who feels they have insight is free to weigh in, of course[/quote] Those types of players do not like there being loot that they cannot obtain. Adepts offer a small advantage over normal weapons, but are mostly a trophy type reward. Even if they were exactly the same with the minor cosmetic and name difference, there would still be those consoling about being unable to obtain them. A lot of their value and desirability come from them being rarer and less accessible. The problem these people ignore is that making them more common defeats the point and the appeal of the weapons.
