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Edited by Lord Magris:
1/4/2024 5:12:53 AM
23
Man, These Newer Dungeons are Hard to Solo
Just completed my first solo Warlord's Ruin. Definitely died a few times, so no flawless clear. But I don't think I'm going to attempt to do it again. A final boss with 14,000,000 HP drags on for ages and it feels like anything could kill you at any moment. For most players, I can say for certain that something like Restoration will feel necessary at least for the final encounter because it is rough. And then if you go into final stand without heavy ammo... Bless the pillar I dodged around crouched for 2 minutes.
[spoiler]I've heard that you can actually jump down from the final stand tower, but I don't know if there's faults with that.[/spoiler]
Most of the dungeon I cleared using a Fusion Grenade-spam Verity's Brow Warlock with Well of Radiance. I also had Heat Rises equipped so that I could consume the grenade to heal if necessary. My first death was after the second boss (the Taken Ogre) during the parkour bit with the flying rocks. They took me out. Then I died multiple times to the final boss. But I eventually beat it by swapping to a Solar Karnstein Armlets Restoration build.
Also shoutouts to Dragon's Breath. I don't know how else I would've beaten it without that beautiful rocket launcher.
...Feedback-wise, I do still think that future dungeons need toned down a bit. I'm not even going to attempt to solo Ghosts of the Deep at all with how it is. It's just that if you keep ramping up the difficulty to put a lot of challenge on players with newer end-game builds, things are going to get out of hand. It's like power creep, but the enemies have it. It could potentially turn into a situation where most of the LFG posts are asking for carries or offering carries. Of course, that's if future dungeons are somehow even harder than what we got.
Maybe dungeons need a Contest mode on release like raids. Not turned up to 11 like raids, but something challenging with a reward for those try-hards who are just built for the challenge. Then after Contest mode, it can ease back down to something... bearable for most. I'm not talking Shattered Throne-easy, but maybe something like Duality.
EDIT: I've had some time to think about the Warlord's Ruin dungeon some more. For what it is, yes, it is a good dungeon (rewards be debatable). It is also still the newest dungeon, so being able to solo it, I guess, is a bit more impressive than older dungeons at this point, even comparing it to Duality. Something like Duality has a low power recommendation at this point unless you play it on Master difficulty, but enemies are still as aggressive as usual. Though what I think really helps players solo these newer dungeons is Solo Operative from the seasonal artifact. It doesn't make you any tankier, but dealing 25% bonus damage for being on your own is a massive effect. I also might not have completed my solo Warlord's Ruin without Solo Operative either. The dungeon could've been much harder and longer without it.
So, I have mixed feelings about it, but thinking about it, I bet that if the dungeon's recommended power was 1600 like the old dungeons, this would probably be on par with them. I've soloed many of the older dungeons without Solo Operative and they weren't that bad. They're definitely more survivable due to their recommended power. I don't think the same way for Ghosts of the Deep regardless. It would probably still be pretty annoying even at 1600 power. I have no clue how people have the patience to do that one.
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I managed to get every solo flawless dungeon completed and gotta say, the more it goes on, the more frustating it gets. Starting from the easiest: -Pit of heresy is easy and short, it gets risky only after the tunnels. -Shattered Throne was tough at the beginning since it was the very first dungeon, then we got used to mechanics and recieved reworks one after another. -Prophecy is still my favourite dungeon, a tough one at the final boss fight before having subclasses 3.0, I struggled for that but I loved it. -Grasp is fun, quite manageble and....... intriguing with the sparrow area but chill. -Duality is a fair challenge for the first 2 encounters, then Caiatl smashes you if you don't move, the bell mechanic gives tension. -Spire started with the health issue, not this much for Akelous but because of Persys. I hate wyverns now. -Warlords Ruin is on par with Spire for lenght and difficulty, shares the fact that final boss oneshots you badly, + a gazillion of ads and two minibosses to deal with and fart-like-lenght duration of damage phases. -Ghosts is terrible, mechanincs are interesting but they drag soo long you're shooting your nerves straight up, specially final boss. 14 million fir each boss, on top of ads on ads on ads, moths, overshields, oppressivly long mechanincs........ it's the only dungeon I despite and I'm happy the Craftening happened, so I took revenge on those 2 dipshits of bosses. It's not ok if even Eso takes an hour to kill off Simmumah.
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I just hate Ghosts of the Deep.
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1 ReplyThere are quite the amount of type As in here. I agree that the dungeons have gotten more challenging for solo flawless. I spent a good amount of time learning and flawlessing some of the dungeons, and I still revel in those victories. But some of these dungeons arent gonna happen for me. And they seem to be staying at the same difficulty, which is sad to me for the reasons above. Solo flawless dungeons was like the only reason to play D2, for me. Grasp of Avarice was perfeft IMO for solo flawless. Good pacing, marathon not a sprint for 25 year olds. I agree with you. However, there are different kinds of players.
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My first solo flawless dungeon was pit of heresy . Then i did shattered throne , prophecy and grasp of avarice . Try those first . Those are fun , they don't have bosses with more health than a raid boss and the mechanics are just simple and fun to do . I don't get it why people would do ghost of the deep , duality and that new one when you can do actual fun dungeons ... You do whatever you want with your game time but you are litterally complaining about them so why even play them in the first place ??
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1 ReplyEdited by GPrime96: 1/3/2024 3:42:02 PM[quote] I'm not even going to attempt to solo Ghosts of the Deep at all with how it is.[/quote] I wouldn’t blame you. Two of those dungeons are very, very different mechanic wise: In Warlord’s Ruin, for the final boss, you kill the eyes, kill two boss Chieftains, charge up the pillars during the same time you melee the Ravager so they die to the Taken Corruption while avoiding getting hit, then damage the boss. Ghost of The Deep Simmumah however, oh boy. You kill the moths she spawn at the beginning, activate Deep Sight, lure the major knight to the symbol you want to kill at (make sure you’re not at the middle one because that don’t work as a the first one) and kill it at the highlighted area or near it to bring Simmumah and Xivu Arath symbol to aline with the circle that shows up to make the symbol you completed pop up above it, do that 2 more times at the remaining symbols, kill the 3 mini bosses for the right symbol and remember what symbol you just got, deposit the right symbol to the area you completed, stand at the highlighted spots, pop her overshield, then you can damage her actual health. While between symbols, you have to deal with Simmumah hurling moths at you so you have to kill them everytime until you’re done with the symbols. Then she do it randomly. That’s just for one boss at GoTD which is one of the reasons it’s so hated by the community
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[quote]Just completed my first solo Warlord's Ruin. Definitely died a few times, so no flawless clear. But I don't think I'm going to attempt to do it again. A final boss with 14,000,000 HP drags on for ages and it feels like anything could kill you at any moment. For most players, I can say for certain that something like Restoration will feel necessary at least for the final encounter because it is rough. And then if you go into final stand without heavy ammo... Bless the pillar I dodged around crouched for 2 minutes. [spoiler]I've heard that you can actually jump down from the final stand tower, but I don't know if there's faults with that.[/spoiler] Most of the dungeon I cleared using a Fusion Grenade-spam Verity's Brow Warlock with Well of Radiance. I also had Heat Rises equipped so that I could consume the grenade to heal if necessary. My first death was after the second boss (the Taken Ogre) during the parkour bit with the flying rocks. They took me out. Then I died multiple times to the final boss. But I eventually beat it by swapping to a Solar Karnstein Armlets Restoration build. Also shoutouts to Dragon's Breath. I don't know how else I would've beaten it without that beautiful rocket launcher. ...Feedback-wise, I do still think that future dungeons need toned down a bit. I'm not even going to attempt to solo Ghosts of the Deep at all with how it is. It's just that if you keep ramping up the difficulty to put a lot of challenge on players with newer end-game builds, things are going to get out of hand. It's like power creep, but the enemies have it. It could potentially turn into a situation where most of the LFG posts are asking for carries or offering carries. Of course, that's if future dungeons are somehow even harder than what we got. Maybe dungeons need a Contest mode on release like raids. Not turned up to 11 like raids, but something challenging with a reward for those try-hards who are just built for the challenge. Then after Contest mode, it can ease back down to something... bearable for most. I'm not talking Shattered Throne-easy, but maybe something like Duality. EDIT: I've had some time to think about the Warlord's Ruin dungeon some more. For what it is, yes, it is a good dungeon (rewards be debatable). It is also still the newest dungeon, so being able to solo it, I guess, is a bit more impressive than older dungeons at this point, even comparing it to Duality. Something like Duality has a low power recommendation at this point unless you play it on Master difficulty, but enemies are still as aggressive as usual. Though what I think really helps players solo these newer dungeons is Solo Operative from the seasonal artifact. It doesn't make you any tankier, but dealing 25% bonus damage for being on your own is a massive effect. I also might not have completed my solo Warlord's Ruin without Solo Operative either. The dungeon could've been much harder and longer without it. So, I have mixed feelings about it, but thinking about it, I bet that if the dungeon's recommended power was 1600 like the old dungeons, this would probably be on par with them. I've soloed many of the older dungeons without Solo Operative and they weren't that bad. They're definitely more survivable due to their recommended power. I don't think the same way for Ghosts of the Deep regardless. It would probably still be pretty annoying even at 1600 power. I have no clue how people have the patience to do that one.[/quote] Whats the complaint here? Cause it’s supposed to be hard and you are literally proving the whole point right. Its hard to solo flawless and because the boss has so much HP you feel like you can die at any moment increasing that tension and difficulty
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1 ReplyGot my Solo Flawless for Warlord’s Ruin done tonight; I’d put its Solo difficulty about on par with SotW (at least during the Season it was introduced, prior to the LFR nerf), and a bit easier than Duality and GotD. As has been the case with each Dungeon since GoA, I went into WR upon release and slowly worked my way through each encounter blind, figuring out the mechanics and putting together builds for each encounter that worked for me, getting my first multi-segment completion last week. Since it’s buff a couple Seasons back, Vesper of Radius has easily become my go to Warlock Exotic, having gotten me through my Solo Flawless for GotD and now WR. Its ability to rapidly generate Class Ability energy based on the number of nearby enemies allows for regular use of Healing Rift with little downtime given the number of adds present. I found Vesper especially helpful in the final boss fight in WR against the Scorn that Hex you, as Vesper causes your Rift to emit damaging shockwaves that also [i][b]blind[/b][/i] your opponents; this allows you to simply smack the Hexers to pass the debuff back to them as the stumble away, unable to fight back. Now it’s just a matter of getting the Exotic Sidearm and finishing the last bits of the Quest to work toward the Catalyst. (΄◉◞౪◟◉｀)
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thank god, finally
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2 RepliesDestiny players when the hard content is hard:
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13 Repliesthis new dungeon is kinda perfect ( outside the guns) , the final boss made some trash guns meta for solo play ( ron gl), the hp are fine if they don't add stupid shields like GOTD , just look older dungeon where boss have no hp all easy to do flawless .
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24 RepliesIf the hp is too much, get 3 ppl. It's easier to do now. Don't complain about the solo if it's too hard for you. That's the point.
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after leaving the spire dungeons I stopped playing on the master level, it's stupid and a waste of time where you run around and try not to die most of the time, waste so much time for what? that gaschnt solo I have experience prophesy solo flawless, but all that is offered to us now is pain and a meaningless game, I remember how we farmed duality last boss master it was fast and fun when you and your team know what to do and everyone has their own role, with since then I have so much armor with an additional slot (which makes new dungeons meaningless) this game needs a good balance, but every time it gets worse and worse... I think this is my last season, because I don’t see the point of just promises but in fact they are just false useless, incapable of anything, their time has passed, I’m waiting for Sony to take control of everything or the ruin and death of the franchise (so that there would be a good example of how to lose everything due to stupid ambitions and monetization)
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6 RepliesDungeons do have a contest mode. The Master option caps you 20 levels under. 1820 is yhe hoghest you need to be for any content in the game.
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Warlord’s isn’t too bad, especially since we have solo operative and way better mods/weapons. Ghost of the Deep was a nightmare tho
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On my best run I got to final boss in 30 minutes. And took the final boss slow so ended up with a 69 minutes (nice) completion. Everyone can have their opinion on whether the dungeon is fun or not. But I think the solo is more then fair. It beats ghost of the deep and it's underwater sections by MILES IMO.
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3 RepliesEdited by Sarus-X: 1/3/2024 7:02:48 AMTbh, I'm kind of in-between. I don't want the dungeons to be easy, but I don't want them to take forever. I view difficulty and time-to-kill for bosses to be very different statistics, and a hard boss can be quick to kill while an easy boss with a chunky health pool is just boring as hell. I don't like the idea of the only "difficult" aspect of an activity being the endurance and mental focus you need. I personally love a chonky boss so long as it only takes a minute or two to get to dps phase. Ghost bosses are just unnecessarily tedious and should be tuned way down (I think the shield is fine considering arbalest is a one shot on normal). I think Ghosts just takes way too long to get through even if you go fast. My solo flawless was around 80 minutes, and I was trying to go fast and reckless. Point is, a chonky boss isn't the issue, it's the design of the fights that make a bad encounter, but I don't think Warlord's Ruin has any bad designs at all. Every aspect of speed involved can go faster if you know how to do it and are skilled enough to do it. I can see good teams getting through this dungeon in less than half an hr, and maybe a solo flawless may take 40-50 minutes, but I don't think it would take longer than an hr to do this one. I think it's right where it needs to be. However, the game itself is pretty inconsistent with it's performance, and I think that will get players killed more than anything. The combat and AI feel rushed as hell, and there has been no improvements since Destiny 2's debut. It's just been added on, and it feels sloppy. The gunplay is the only good feeling part of combat in my opinion. That and the explosions.
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2 RepliesTrust me I’m if you want to see true difficulty then play lies of p or dark souls at least they reward you for skill most of the time
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1 ReplyI think it often gets overlooked that older Dungeons were hard. Solo Prophecy in Season 11 was [i]brutal[/i], and that was at the height of Mountaintop + Recluse + Anarchy meta. They might be jokes now, but Pit of Heresy and Shattered Throne were also very tough, back in the day. To the best of my memory, must Dungeon bosses have been between 3 and 5 phases for a solo in their season of release, with an appropriate loadout and build. It's also somewhat disingenuous to only refer to raw HP values. A boss that has 1,000x more health than normal is nothing if it receives 10,000x more damage. I don't know if there is a newer version of this to include Crota's End and/or Warlord's Ruin, but here is a good breakdown of Raid and Dungeon boss health when properly compared to one another. https://twitter.com/TheAegisRelic/status/1681164947856736257 As an example, Caretaker has by far the most raw HP of any boss, at nearly 29 million, but also takes significantly more damage, so the [i]effective[/i] HP is less than that of Rhulk, despite his raw HP being lower by more than 13 million.
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I dunno I think its probably the fairest solo dungeon yet. My only issue with the dungeon is every gun besides the legendary sidearm are hot garbage.
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If they never nerfed the health pool of the Ghosts bosses after the numerous complaints from everyone, including the elites and big name creators, about how high they were (especially with the shield) They aren't gonna nerf Warlord's.
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Solar hunter restoration build with cure and incandescent handcannon for part 1 and 2, void invis hunter with graviton and devour constantly procced for boss
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Dungeons are supposed to be hard to solo….thats the point of the solo triumph; if it was easy to clear like it is with 3 players it wouldn’t be much of a triumph. Last boss absolutely is easier with a form of sustain. 14 mil is a large number but when the crit spot is the size of the moon it doesn’t move it’s fairly easy to “1 phase” (not 1 floor) the boss solo. Just ensure you’re farming enough ammo to stay topped on heavy.
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Edited by viiTactiiCZz: 1/2/2024 11:34:45 AMThe newer dungeons (ghosts/warlord) have had the bosses health inflated because of player builds. Personally I'm 50/50 on adding a modifier like Multiplicity to scale health on fireteam size to dungeons - but it has to be boss health only; im not up for having to shoot adds more than normal because i have 3 instead of 2 in a fireteam
