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Edited by Spawn:
10/10/2018 6:49:19 PM
209
Bringing Sniping Back in Destiny 2! (To: Sandbox Team)
Sandbox Team.
With the next few updates I think a large portion of the community would be really happy to see some positive changes for snipers in the crucible.
In today's meta, the strength, range, ammo advantages, and overall usability of shotguns make them a clear choice as the superior weapon. Many of us want to branch out and use snipers but with how they work in the game today... it's just not realistic.
- [b]Flinch[/b]
I think anyone who has attempted to snipe in the past few weeks will tell you that the flinch on snipers in unreasonably bad. The maps are already small but even when you are far enough away and well within "sniper" range, a handcannon shot from across the map can still send your reticle into the sky. I think most of us don't mind how powerful pulses are in the current meta but a sniper should be the better choice at longe ranges... and right now it's clearly not.
Also, horizontal flinch is probably one of the most frustrating game mechanics and makes all snipers feel very flimsy.
- [b]Handling[/b]
If you put Destiny 1 back into your console and pull out a sniper, you'll immediately notice that holding one feels much different. It doesn't have the sluggish feeling that most snipers in Destiny 2 (Note: on console)
- [b]Scopes[/b]
Small maps in Destiny 2 is fun. It keeps the gameplay exciting knowing there are always enemies right around the corner. The fact that snipers are long scoped, high zoomed weapons makes them really tough to use in most situations. Most lanes are not more than a few hundred feet, so using a long range scope on these maps is about as useful as trying to use a telescope to read a book. It's just unnecessary and does more harm than good.
- [b]Aim Assist / Hitbox Size[/b]
I truly believe that you can fix snipers even if you only touch ONE of these two things. If you want to argue that snipers shouldn't have aim assist and everyone should just [i]get good[/i] that's fine but then we need to increase the size of the hitbox. Just play a game with a sniper or watch someone else do it. The amount of times that you will get a body shot that you thought was a headshot is far too often. Watching the clips back in slow motion, I really think the hitbox is just too small. That combined with the flinch means that you will lose most 1v1's where the other player is looking your general direction.
- [b]Damage[/b]
Imagine you hear a super pop, you are aware of their location, manage to escape, gain some distance, turn around and make an incredible play to headshot them. To your dismay, sniping a sentinel / hammer / nova warp in the head only for them to notice you and then proceed to wipe the floor with you using their super is frankly just defeating. You did everything right, you made the right decisions, the skilled play, and still lost. Sniper headshots should kill supers. Enough said.
In conclusion, there is currently not a single situation in the game today where a sniper is the better choice for the everyday player. Up close you will lose to shotguns, sidearms, fusions, etc. At range you will lose to pulses, scouts, and even handcannons. Note: Just because you can get kills with a sniper doesn't mean that it's the better option. Just look at the use rates for snipers. Almost non-existent.
I hope you take this as genuine feedback from a long time supporter who loves the game. You've made a lot of strides in the past year and the snipers in the community are ready to make those legendary plays. We don't want easy mode, we want a chance... to make the legendary plays that made us fall in love with the game back in Destiny 1.
Please upvote this and hopefully @dmg is reading this and will pass it along to the sandbox team.
[spoiler]Moderator edit: This thread has been moved to #Feedback forum so that other Destiny players can weigh in. [url=https://www.bungie.net/en/Forum/Post/139533839/0/0] See Cozmo's thread here[/url] for more information about the #Feedback tag and its uses.
Feel free to private message the moderator who moved your post, link to topic for further clarification about why this topic was moved.[/spoiler]
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Edited by slayer britt: 10/10/2018 7:07:21 PMFlinch, handling, and scopes aren't issues- you just have to adapt to those. With forsaken, I've switched to using an even lower handling sniper, the gambit one. The rolls matter a lot, including the scope. Lower zoom scopes tend to have higher handling anyway. Flinch, you just have to get better at countering, plus there are perks and mods that help with it. As for aim assist/hitbox- git gud. I've been maining snipers since D1Y1, there's never really been a need to make sniping easier in this regard. It takes practice- use the same gun, same roll. It will function the same way every time and you'll get used to using it- you'll never have an issue with feeling like that shot should have hit once you get used to it. There are plenty of perks and mods to help if you don't feel the gun performs as consistently as you'd like. First, find a base gun you like, then look for perks to help. Typically higher RoF frames have higher handling. Increased range typically includes more aim assist to help keep your aim more consistent at long range. Firmly Planted is one of my favorite sniper perks currently, but you have to adapt to it. Crouching isn't typically a part of your playstyle, but I've been pairing it with knucklehead radar- helps increase my awareness and lets me use my sniper more often. Plus, when crouched, the radar is better, which encourages me to use crouch more. I've found it makes my sniping more consistent since incorporating it into my playstyle- Firmly Planted is actually a really solid perk. There's also handling/range masterworks I believe, as well as mods (including one for increased aim assist). Find the combination that works for you, and practice with it. As for damage- I completely agree. It needs to be increased. I'm not looking for a one-hit body, but I should be able to kill a super with a headshot. Shotguns seem to shut down supers all the time, but snipers rarely do. Not even the highest impact (not including heavies) can kill supers in one shot. In D1, it was easier to hit supers and still killed them- it's more difficult now to hit them, but far less rewarding. The damage should be increased to allow shotguns to not be only viable counter. One thing you didn't mention was the ammo economy- it really heavily favors shotguns and fusions over snipers. If shoot-to-loot returned, it might be more viable, but I doubt it would. As is, snipers generally lose the ammo from an enemy they kill due to the distance they'll have to cover to get that ammo- someone else will pick it up first or you'll have to battle someone in close quarters for it, typically a shotgunner. And then, you get a single shot. If you miss, the sniper is pointless. Hit a body? Guess you're out of luck unless you're using another mid/long range weapon, but you're screwed up close. The only way a sniper can have a viable ammo situation is to use the scavenger perk so you get extra ammo when you CAN pick it up. Otherwise the sniper just feels incredibly situational, whereas shotties and fusions always feel like they are an option since getting a kill almost guarantees ammo for another kill. All in all, the only things I'd change are to improve damage and ammo economy changes. Shotguns might need some changes, but I think the biggest issue is just in the map designs favoring shotguns. I think some favoritism towards snipers would go a ways towards evening the playing field. Damage and ammo probably would do the most overall IMO. Anything else might make them too strong. Edit: Holy wall of text, batman!
