[quote] [b]“Let me get this straight, they’re designing a loot box system based almost entirely around power upgrades?” That’s what ran through my head when I first heard that as a trade-off for free map and hero DLC, Star Wars Battlefront 2 would be turning to a loot box-based microtransaction model instead. But instead of focusing on cosmetics, the loot boxes would be the cornerstone of the entire progression and upgrade system of the game. Loot box controversies have hit Forza 7 and Shadow of War recently, but after this weekend’s Battlefront 2 beta, I’m sensing another storm brewing, and frankly, I’m a bit surprised I haven’t heard more about it to date.[/b] While I liked most of what I saw in Battlefront 2’s beta this weekend in terms of actual gameplay, the loot boxes did give me pause, and the entire system seems as strange as it did when it was first announced months ago. Granted, it is somewhat hard to tell how the system will work in a live game, as the contents of the boxes will expand, credit accumulation may be different and of course, there will be a way to purchase these loot boxes outright, as that is the entire monetization model of the game (other than selling it to you for $60, of course). But in an era when the one type of loot boxes that are usually seen as acceptable are the ones based around cosmetic upgrades, Battlefront 2’s boxes are unabashedly entirely about power upgrades. The “Star Card” system gives you flat damage upgrades, reduces damage taken, decreases cooldowns, gives modifiers to skills, doles out new weapons, and so on. The only cosmetic item I’ve even seen in a Battlefront 2 loot box so far has been a victory pose for the MVP screen. I’m still trying to wrap my head around this. Yes, you are able to buy loot crates with in-game currency by simply playing the game. You accumulate them at a somewhat decent clip in the beta, but it’s hard to know how that will play out in the final game (these accumulation rates usually slow down over time as we’ve seen for loot boxes in Overwatch, Destiny 2, etc.). But eventually, a system will go live where players will be able to purchase loot boxes with cash, and then that raises a whole host of new questions. The primary one is “does this make Battlefront 2 pay-to-win?” Pay-to-win is a weirdly nebulous concept these days. In a game like say, Pokémon GO, players can shell out for lures and incense and XP boosting eggs, and while that will get them more Pokémon (and more powerful Pokémon) than others, the game itself does not really have a “win state,” so technically, by definition, it can’t be pay-to-win. Battlefront 2, a mostly multiplayer-based game, does have clear winners and losers each match, but obviously player skill and teamwork will by far the biggest deciding factors. A great player with zero Star Cards will probably be able to take down a player with maxed Star Cards. But that’s a very specific case. On average, a team full of players with high-end Star Cards is probably going to beat a team with lower-end Star Cards, not to mention the folks that would pay/grind for those top-tier upgrades may also play more/be higher skilled to begin with. And if these loot boxes are purchasable from the get-go, yes, I can imagine that players who buy say, 50 boxes on launch day will be at an advantage over someone who is going to grind out 50 boxes over the course of the next month, even if the “opportunity” is there for them to get the same amount of crates when one pays and one doesn’t. And even if the skill gap is what largely determine who comes out on top, not these upgrades, it’s still psychologically frustrating to be killed by an enemy and have the game show you that they have top-tier Star Cards equipped when you don’t. That seems like a power move on EA’s part to make players think “well shoot, maybe I should buy some loot boxes if I want to compete.” Or in contrast, players may just think it sucks and they go play a different game that’s less irritating. This system also raises the question of what happens when a new player shows up six months down the road and enters a game where not only are they a new player, but their enemies are stacked with 10% increased damage, 30% lower cooldown and 20% increase fire rate Star Cards while they have almost nothing. [b]How can they even compete at that point?[/b] [b]But past the “pay-to-win” debate, what’s almost more troubling to me is how Battlefront 2’s loot boxes represent the twisting of the entire progression system of the game, which was torn down from a perfectly fine base and rebuilt using randomized loot box drops as a basis for advancement instead. In short, Battlefront 2’s core progression and unlock mechanics have been flat-out made worse to accommodate a loot box economy.[/b] Call of Duty, though the series has also gotten its own type of loot boxes lately, still mostly remains rooted in the a variant of the same progression system it’s had for ages. You play more with a gun, you unlock more things with that gun. You play with a class, you unlock more skills for that class. Eventually, when COD realized that players were tired of grinding past milestones for things they did want, they instituted a kind of token system where you could unlock stuff in whatever order you wanted, earning more tokens the more you played. [b]Battlefront and Battlefield have also had some version of this system where playing more as a sniper/medic/fighter pilot/tank driver would unlock more options for those guns/vehicles/classes. But with Battlefront 2, that has all been scrapped and replaced with a loot box system that is almost entirely random, and only is not random when you’re getting crafting components from loot boxes that may allow you to fashion a specific upgrade or weapon every once in a while. [/b] [b]This system is just miles worse than a traditional progression system that allows players to choose what they want to upgrade. While loot boxes could work in a game like this sprinkling in extra stuff here and there, used as the entire core of the progression system, it's beyond frustrating. You’re now not just grinding for upgrades, your grinding for the chance at an upgrade that you actually want, and not only that, things like class rank are now determined by how many Star Cards you have for that character, not how much XP/kills/etc. you’ve gained with that character. That strikes me as mildly insane. [/b] [b]There is a world where yes, I can imagine Battlefront 2 selling loot boxes with different cosmetic armor variations or ship decals or gun skins or emotes or what have you, but instead they’ve integrated loot boxes into the very DNA of the game, making them the root of the progression system and without question, instituted a system where they are flat-out selling power. [/b] This is bad. To me, it’s worse than the recent Forza and Shadow of War situations, given that the loot boxes are completely unextractable from the game, as they make up the entirety of its progression system. What EA and DICE are doing here is genuinely something I’ve never seen done before with loot boxes, and I feel like it has the potential to go very, very wrong. [/quote] read teh bold for tldr. fellas how do we stop this pay to win trash before it dies like p2wbattlefront 1? thread pic link unrelated: http://puu.sh/xTsvp.png https://www.forbes.com/sites/insertcoin/2017/10/08/star-wars-battlefront-2s-loot-boxes-seem-like-theyre-going-to-be-a-serious-problem/#29a6a47d6323 What most people overlook when taking the "you can just ignore it" route with loot boxes and microtransactions in general is that games will begin to get DESIGNED so they facilitate loot boxes.