Couldn't agree more mate!

Bump

Spot on apart from you should drop a higher light than you have already equipped. Drops need attention. People will keep playing once they have the gear they want but will enjoy the game more. Plus have more time to help the new and lower light players. At the moment it's a big ask to get there and help others in the time we can attribute to the game.

That was a great post my friend. Good points. I'm going to add you to my friends list. My GT is wickedout2015. I need a good team that can help me get better stuff. I'm a hunter with a score of 305. Again thanks.

You speak for a lot of the community but I also disagree with guaranteed 1-2 LL within your currently equipped. That's just a grind still. I think there should be a grind but that you can't get lower item than you have equipped.

Agreed

TLDR is TLDR

I didn't read it because I'm tired and I'm still trying to understand the -blam!-ing macroeconomics homework for tomorrow. I can't wait to drop this -blam!-ing subject, it is so -blam!-ing boring.

To long to read also who cares about light anyway?

Please learn what tl;dr means.

Absolutely agree with everything you just said, 110% spot on! Bungie need to read this big time!!!!

I think the Devs and new CEO need to make new characters to understand. If the new CEO doesn't step up, he might as well also "step down".

Bungie wants as much playtime for as little content as possible, given that their model is perfect.

I stopped reading at "please respond" I lol'd

Thanks for putting this post out there. Even if Bungie doesn't respond directly, they do read these. I hope that posts like this one will cause Bungie to reevaluate the way that end-game loot drops. All of my close friends have moved on from Destiny because, after playing TTK raid and Trials, realized the daunting grind it would take to (hopefully) reach max light, and decided that it wasn't worth the effort/frustration. I thought that the goal was to make player progression more within the player's control in TTK, versus prev dlc, but the exact opposite has occurred. Progression is more based on dumb luck now than ever before.

Unfortunately bungie won't read this. If they do, they won't respond

Think I would raid again if this was a thing

[quote]TL/DR at bottom. So far the most common complaint my clan members and other players I meet have with this game is the reward system. You tried to make it better in ttk, but its actually gotten much worse, and here is my way of breaking own my opinion and explaining it to you. So year 1 drops rates weren't great, "forever 29" was a real problem, took me till year 2 to get a crux of crota, the list of general gripes is enormous. But at least when you got a drop in year 1, it had the potential to be max light. When you finally got that fatebringer or visions it was as good as it could be. Even with the drop rates we only had to fight two rng rolls, getting something at all and getting what we wanted. Now we're here in year 2, with a "smart loot" system that doesn't work, and more roll checks than ever. To actually increase your light level in current pve endgame you need to: roll to get anything but moldering shards in the first place, roll to actually get the piece you need, roll to get decent perks on it, and then roll to get an actual light level worth mentioning. That's 4 different instances of rng, making you nearly 4 times as unlikely to actually get anything you want from the raid's usual drops. Then you came out with challenge mode, this was actually a great idea, add a little challenge (or not, however you look at it) and give people a drop that is guaranteed to roll at the max light level. That was a great way to help shore up people's weakness and give them a better chance. But then you missed completely by making all 3 challenges drop artifacts, completely ignoring the ghost shell and class items slots. Yeah technically oryx can drop them, but thats a problem in itself, the final boss shouldn't drop the same gear that the puzzles do, effort vs reward. So now you have 2 equipment slots that people still have to just pray to rngesus will one day get lucky enough to be 320. In light of the brevity of destiny's endgame, which has always been a problem, it really makes it feel like TTK was built to just pad play time with awful rng. I've seen countless players excited about the game, drop it because after raiding since launch they still haven't been able to get that one upgrade they need, and they know there is a very real possibility they never will. You're actually losing players by taking away their tangible goals. When the drops are so rng heavy, people lose their hope to ever get what they actually need, and decide to stop wasting their time, because after all its a game, and game's are supposed to be fun, they're supposed to reward you when you put in enough effort. Even in MMO's where the boss drops 2 pieces of loot for 40 people eventually your whole team will have it and it will be your turn. Light level should be a good indication of your experience in the endgame, and max should be a badge of honor for being at the peak of your chosen endgame be it pve or pvp. You could even let people get light 320 gear in nightfall, just put unique perks on the raid, trials, IB, etc gear to give people a reason to desire it, and that itself would be a good incentive. As it is, I can raid every week since launch and never get a class item (which is exactly my situation lol), and at the same time a new clan member can come in and reach 319 in a month thanks to luck, there's an inherent problem there, an inherent fault in your effort vs reward formula. You could have made all raid gear 320, and the random perks and infusion would have given people reason enough to keep running it every week. But with the current system, people get burnt out quick and soon part ways with the game, which is the exact opposite of what you want, right? I get that you want to make it so people have to raid multiple times to reach max light, thats fine I agree with it. But there should never be a possibility that you will never improve. The best thing you could have done was tune your system so that no matter the endgame activity (raid or trials) all drops were guaranteed to be within 1 to 2 ppints higher than your current. That would guarantee progress, and eventually reaching your goal, while also controlling the speed at which people level by eliminating large jumps. As it stands now, it would probably be difficult for you to make a change like that so here's what you can do right now to help raise your player's hopes again. Change the challenge rewards to where each one drops one of the unrepresented slots. Warpriest is artifact, Golgy is ghost shell, and oryx is class item. Hell even just adding another one of your favorite rng rolls to it and making it so it has a chance to be one of the three would be better than nothing. I've got a lot of time in this game, 38 days across my characters, 100+ raid clears, I enjoy it, but atm the only reason I'm still playing it is because of my clan members, I'm actually relieved when I get my 3 raids in because it means I can play something else for the rest of the week. Do you see the problem there? I'm so burnt out that if I ever get that class item, the only thing that will keep me in the game is the people I play with, there is no draw from the game itself, because it doesn't reward you for your effort. And I know I'm not the only one. I know it was long but please read it and respond, I'm grasping at reasons to keep playing your game because I like the way it feels and the community around it, but these are my sincere concerns with the current state of endgame. Add on: (for the record I have a 319 warlock, titan, and hunter) TL:DR The current system for endgame teir rewards makes you 4 times as unlikely to get an upgrade as in year 1. A better system would be to guarantee drops between 1 or 2 light levels over you're current equipped. This would guarantee progression at a controllable rate for longevity in the endgame. Or make all endgame gear 320 and use unique perks as incentive for peoplw to raid/trials/etc. An easy band aid for the current mess would be to make each challenge mode drop a different non boss slot. WP os artifact, golgy is ghost shell, and Oryx is class item. As it is now light level is nothing but a measure of luck and general competency (even that is debatable), and it should be an indicator of endgame experience. This severe imbalance in effort vs reward has led many players to give up on the game do to dissapointment and the possibility of never getting what they need. There's a problem when my favorite part of destiny every week is when I dont feel the need to play it anymore. There was more but I digress.[/quote] What about the rng glitches that also give u one ghost shell per week per your 3 runs on the nightfalls and not to mention getting at least 80% of the time a next big thing or that vanguard sidearm that shall not be named from legendary specials u buy from the cryptarch? So with all the rng they also add certain guns to the loot pool at a higher percent. This is based of streamers I watch like krafyy and hovey and such have all voiced there opinion on those 2 same guns. I def have gotten those 2 far more then any other guns from oh cryptodouche. Do u notice this also?

I am in full agreement. Destiny is a great game and has a lot of potential. However, too much of the game is based off of luck and RNG. If I didn't have friends to play this game with me, I would quickly get tired of it. They did add a lot of stuff to keep you occupied with TTK which was awesome, but the rewards for the effort seemed lackluster to say the least. I think Bungie did amazing work with the heroic challenge for the Black Spindle. It was a great and fun challenge that in the end gave you a GUARANTEED drop with a fitting reward for the intense fighting. Me and two other friends tried countless times for four hours and we finally did it with two seconds to spare. It was one of the very few times I felt adrenaline playing the game and it was the most fun I had ever had, and the best part was [i]I felt satisfied.[/i] The grind was worth it in end. The sad part is this is the only part of the game I can vouch for. Bungie needs to add more challenges with guaranteed and fitting rewards like this. Iron Banner, the raid, and most of the game I feel is just a giant grind with little satisfaction turn out, and now the only real reason I play this game is because it's fun to play with friends. Sorry for the tl;dr post, but I feel like this is a point worth making.

Yes this is my only grip. I want to raid, been trying to raid, and still haven't till this day. I want better gear, but it seems the only way I see it, is by doing the raid. I would like to see Bungie change this, but I don't know. To give us better options getting better gear for the ones trying or willing to raid but can't seem to find a good fireteam willing to help out which has been a problem for me. Thus is why I saying they should add match making to raiding. Some say this will not work, some say it's a good idea. But for those like myself, it should be a option. PvP should reward better gear non the less. Maybe base it on the number of kills or somehow increase the drop rate a tad to give better stuff. Same with Nightfalls. I really didn't get anything to be YAH about. Being at 303 light and getting 260+ gear all the time or most of the time is a bit annoying at times. Granted I don't want anything handed to me no, but for your accomplishments I feel you should have a increase on getting something good rather then a 260 ghost. I love the game, and still enjoy it as always, but I think and not trying to speak for the community but more less this is the feeling I get from the community. MMO's I have played from WoW to this, and to keep the community happy, the rewards system, and content are just 2 of the main things people like to see. You got to keep the community coming back, and don't give up on them. Content is the main reason to keep the community coming back. Good story drving, Good PvP/PvE and rewards system. Heck i'll pay for more DLC's. I'll support Bungie all the way, but make the rewards better and make the loot scale a tad better for doing such things. Give the people what they want and like to see. For me, I want to enjoy the Kings Fall raid, but never had the chance to. I IB is fun, I had some fun times and did pretty well, but the rewards were meh compared to what you could get. Nightfalls, Y1, were actually pretty descent, but I did the nightfall on all 3 toons, and really the only thing I got was blue 260's and 15 strange coins. I think, this is what upsets the community more then anything, and while a lot of them are bored with it. Me, I have a lot of work to do on Destiny, and will continue to support Bungie, but don't make it stale for the community. While its good, well it can always be better. That's my feeling on this whole matter. Too the community, stop trying to nerf everything because you feel its to OP, I'd rather see posts on making the game better rather then guns and gear. The content to me is what keeps the story driving. The negative vibes and the hating on Destiny / Bungie is flooding with a lot of this. I understand, and see your point of view. But lets come up with some form of positive vibes to help Bungie. :)

Bump. Bungie doesn't listen to any ideas that mess with their strategy on getting you addicted through RNG. The smart loot is a bit of a joke, though have to say with one faction it kind of worked. But end game rewards. Pff. I got a 308 old titan mark last IB, infused it up to 315. Camelot mark wouldn't drop so I bought it. Rank 5 package a 312 old titan mark. All that grind for nothing. First completion of hard Oryx, had it not been the Warpriest challenge mode all I would have got would be a 316 mark at Oryx! Friends and I have gone through the normal raid without a drop and then taking those moldering shards too!

Ohhhh id bump and liked it.

Bump! I enjoyed the entirety of your statement. No need for the summary. As for loot I couldn't agree more. I hope these issues are addressed, but I am not counting on it. Until then I will still continue to enjoy this amazing game for as long as I can.

it's inly gotten worse because they introduced this new, totally unnecessary, bullshit light system not only do you have to be a certain LEVEL, you also have to be a certain light level? what is this bullshit? that's the problem you thought #forever29 was bad, how about MICRO-leveling? in the end your light level doesn't matter too much anyway, I feel bad for anyone who still believes in this crap, and grinds for a perfect 320 piece in real MMO's your level and level of your gear actually matter, they don't have secondary level bullshit Bungie introduced in TTK

Pointless,bungie will neither read this nor respond.