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originally posted in:The Ashen Conflux
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Edited by Ruin Tree:
11/23/2015 10:03:10 PM
148
The Hive and the Beckenstein Limit
[b]WARNING[/b]: This post is not for the faint of heart. It contains advanced modern physics, including but not limited to: branes, higher-dimensional space, lower-dimensional space.
In the mission The World's Grave, your Ghost mentions that the Hive have broken something known as the Beckenstein Limit. I know I'm not the only one who had no idea what that was at first. Wikipedia defines it thus:
[quote]In physics, the Beckenstein bound is an upper limit on the entropy S, or information I, that can be contained within a given finite region of space which has a finite amount of energy—or conversely, the maximum amount of information required to perfectly describe a given physical system down to the quantum level.[/quote]
In short, the Beckenstein Limit is a hard stop, limiting the amount of information that can possible be contained in a finite region of space. Then how could the Hive have broken this limit, crammed more stuff into a finite space than should be possible?
One physics book I've been recently reading may have the answer. It talks about higher dimensional spaces, both very large and very small. Based on this, I see two explanations as to how the Hive store their info in the World's Grave.
[b]1.[/b] Tiny rolled-up dimensions. Say you took a (roughly) 2D piece of paper and started to roll it up. If you roll it up tightly enough, it will simply look like a (roughly) 1D line. Similarly, if you take a 3D coordinate grid and roll up the z-axis (height) tightly enough, it will look like a 2D plane. It could be possible that the Hive have harnessed an extremely (extremely) tiny rolled-up fourth spatial dimension to store their info. This would be rolled up so small that all of our technology would be too crude to detect it.
[b]2.[/b] A hidden higher-dimensional space. Our [i]observable[/i] universe exists in four dimensions: three of space, one of time. It's conceivable that this exists on something known as a brane. A brane is a lower-dimensional section of a higher-dimensional space, known as the bulk. Typically, particles and forces (with the exception of gravity) are confined to a brane, but it's plausible that the Hive somehow have punched through into the bulk and stored their info there.
Of course, it might be something simpler. The World's Grave might stretch across different realities, storing a bit of info here, a bit there. Or it might be just Bungie being Bungie. But I'd like to think it's something more than that.
Or it might be me overcomplicating things
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26 RepliesSort of.... You're clearly drawing from Super String/M-Theory which (in order to get the math to work out that allows it to function as a "Unified Field Theory"/"Theory of Everything") requires that there be ELEVEN dimensions. Ten dimensions of space and one dimension of time. So your points address the question of "Where are the other 7 dimensions" relative to the FOUR dimensions of Space-Time that we can observe. 1 One possibility Is your first point. That they are tiny "rolled up" dimensions that exist far below the subatomic level, and thus (for now) too small for us to observe. 2. The other posibility is your second point. Which is that the dimensions are too MASSIVE to observe, because they essentially exist in the form of parallel universerses, and that our universe is but one in a system of multiple universes. This possibility is intriguing because it offers a possible explanation as to why gravity is so weak in comparison to the other fundamental forces of the universe (Electromagnetism, Strong and Weak nuclear forces). That the (theorized) particles that transmit gravititational forces are able to move BETWEEN branes (universes) while the other three forces are confined to our universe (brane). It also may explain how the Hive are able to store information/communicate in dimensions outside of our every day experience ("gravity waves"). 3. Third possibility is some combination of the two. In referencing the Beckenstein Limit what the Destiny writers were basically telling you is that the Hive are not beholden to physics (of thos universe) as we currently understand them. So that they clealry have access to dimensions (or even universes) that either are not accounted for in our current understanding of Physics.....or operate according to an entirely different set of physics. A possibility hinted in the opening story mission of TTK, when our Ghost tries to make sense of hte "inter-dimensional goo" that the Taken leave behind...and how the process of trying to take/rip from this level of Space-Time fails against a dead Cabal. That the process requires "a living host". ...and that the space being opened upon doesn't operate "by our laws of physics". Even more interesting is the "Ascendant Plane" (Brane?) However, what really opens up some mind-bending possibilities is the difference between the Hive/Taken and the Vex. Which suggest that their technologies/powers are fundamentally different. Both seemed to have mastered the ability to travel through space (supraluminal flight, teleportation)....but only the Vex seemed to have mastered frank time Travel. One possibility is that the Hive/Taken can only move from one spatial dimension to another, while The Vex can manipulate the whole Space/Time fabric. At least the primary four dimesions of our everyday experience.
