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Edited by RoCCa_ToP_SHoTTa:
10/29/2015 5:23:57 PM
79
The Great (Cheese) Debate
So the debate has been ongoing for a few days now. What does everyone think? I see some saying that its a "Smart Strategy". Well that seems odd to me, Isn't that like saying sniping the oracles from atop the ledge in VoG was a "smart start"? It involves the exact same thing....
I think people are confusing a "smart strategy" with a cheesy strategy. If its smartt to leave ogres alive, i guess its also "smart" to snipe oracles from up top, "smart" to cheese the bridge in Crota, etc . I mean lets look at why people cheese, they cheese because the encounter is too hard and complicated for them and their skills are not good enough to overcome the challenge.
My thoughts:
No Knights Cheese - for crappier players, not as skilled, can't communicate well, can't kill an ogre, can't kill a red bar knight with sniper/rocket/machine gun
Killing Knights, (regular Strat) - strat forgetter players, who can kill an ogre, kill a red night, can get back to the middle, can stagger oryx, take out the minimal ads, set off their bombs - oh, and don't wholeheartedly suck at this game
EDIT: It would seem he consensus is becoming clear. Most, even the cheesers, think that performing the intended mechanics takes more skill, while using the other (cheesy) method requires much less skill, lower light levels, lackluster communication, and is able to allow for the complete carry of 2-3 fire team members if necessary (just like the oracle encounter)
EDIT: Question, can someone explain to me how 95% of video posts about the cheese strat were titled with something about how it was a CHEESE< yet everyone that then used that way of doing it now says its not a cheese, instead a "Smart strat"? How did you guys following remove that piece?
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He only difference is that the oracles and oryx arnt glitches. A cheese is an exploited glitch to get the rewards. I agree using a cheese is nooby and requires no skill whatsoever. These cheese include: Infinite down Crota, Pushing Atheon off the edge, jumping over the Crota bridge, or hiding in the wall during Golgoroth gaze. These all involved glitches. These bugs included a timer that missed its que because the host was disconnecting, a boss instantly dyeing by a death barrier, a death barrier failing to activate when the sword is held but the bridge isn't formed, and a hole in a wall big enough for a player to fit their character through while not hitting a death barrier or allowing projectiles to penetrate the wall. Those were all glitches. Now for the strategies. These are free of bugs. The ability to snipe the oracles from where you spawn is not a glitch. It wasn't meant for everyone to be down on the Templars platform. (Although you can if you want). Being able to snipe from above is part of the game mechanics and it's not like you can't get shot or get marked by the oracles. The more you hide yourself from the enemies, the harder it is to shoot oracles. Your damage goes down due to range and your view gets restricted. Now on to Oryx. This fight pertains to killing waves of adds to chain to other events. Start Fight | Adds Spawn | Knights Die | Oryx Moves and Slams / \ Player Steps on Plate Oryx does his thing | | Ogers Spawn. | |. | Ogers Die. | |. | Knghts, Adds, and Bombs spawn. | |. | |. Oryx Slams and Opens |. | |. Guardians Stager him |. | \. / Guardians Must Destroy Bombs to hurt Oryx | After sequence based on health | Repeat this until oryx has no health | Damage Oryx in final stance or die Nowhere in this fight do Knights have to be killed. The guardian just has to detonate the bomb which means that he needs to beat that knight to the bomb whether the night is dead or alive. This is purely based on the logic table presented. Not killing ogers is not a bug in the game. Not killing them is actually more likely to make you not succeed in the logic tables terms. But waiting to kill them just gives the fire team more time to prepare to detonate the bomb with more time to race to it before the knights can get there. Even if Bungie made it so that the Knights spawn regardless of oger deaths, all you would have to do is beat the knight to the bomb. (In which case the knight would wonder and wait for the bomb to spawn and then run to it.). This strategy is not a cheese and is just a smarter way of taking all of the complete mechanics to mind. Nowhere does it say what order or when things of these two branches have to be completed. The only difference between these strategies is that the first group came up with the original strategy first. They could have very easily wiped one more time and realized that ogers don't have to be killed before you stagger Oryx.
