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Edited by OhioStateRulezZ: 10/25/2015 12:54:59 AM
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REMOVING ELEMENTAL PRIMARIES IS A CATASTROPHIC ERROR BUNGIE

Give me Elemental primaries

6004

I'm fine with the new "Variety"

5592

I think the new direction Bungie is going in regards to elemental primaries is two giant steps backwards. This might end up long so bare with me. What I think should've been done in the place of removing elements from primaries was to have a drop from the hard raid that allows you to put an element on any primary for a rather steep price. And in an effort to make the environment still a challenge they should've boosted enemy shields in a couple of ways. Make all shields maybe 25% stronger as well as [i]reducing[/i] the damage of using the wrong element against the shield all while keeping kinetic the same across the board. You see what I just did? I increased the value of Kinetic weapons as it could handle any and all shields the same way while using, for example a solar weapon against void shields would bring down the damage significantly. This still brings that factor of making smart choices with your weapons while still allowing for elements in a way that's not as dominant as in year 1. I cannot shake the feeling that Bungie is scared to make the players of this game too powerful and it's a damn shame. No other game in history has seemed to have a problem with making players ridiculously strong. It's a game for goodness sake let me do crazy shit. This has never been more obvious than with the changes made to perks in 2.0 that they kinda blindsided us with reducing all of their effectiveness. And don't even get me started with the raid gear. Those guns are god awful and have no more use than infusing into other guns. Crazy how raid weapons in year 1 were the most sought after in the game because you knew what you wanted and how you could get it and it made playing the raid worth it. I'm not playing this raid for the gear. I'm playing it for the number attached to the gear which in turn allows my character to reach a higher level, but for what exactly? So you can raise the cap again in a month and repeat the process? That's just silly and obvious that you want your players to meaninglessly grind with no true end goal other than "hey I'm the highest level possible in the game... For a week." The main counter argument in favor of no elemental primaries is that it allows for more variety in choosing a weapon. Let me be the first to call bullcrap on that. I'm willing to bet quite a bit of money that the vast majority of players right now are using the vendor version of Hung Jury for all high level content right now. Simply because it's an [b]easy to obtain gun that packs quite a punch with perks that are really good[/b] (see year 1 raid weapons) Those who aren't using it have been blessed by RNGesus with a better gun which to be honest there simply aren't very many of. The "variety" is a total myth when there will always be a "best gun" regardless if there's an element on it or not. TL;DR: Elemental primaries need to return in a less dominant way than in year 1. Elemental infusion is a start Let me know what you guys think of this. I'm genuinely curious to see the results. Happy Hunting Edit 1: Let me use an analogy. Say you have a product that has sales going crazy good for a year. After a year you make a change to that product without letting anyone know ahead of time. 7 hours later you find out through a poll that half of the users of this product don't like the change you made. That would be catastrophic don't you think? Some food for thought Edit 2: The poll isn't biased because the opposition to my views still has a clear choice. Meaning the data is still accurate Edit 3: People seem to forget that it wasn't just the burns on raid weapons that made them unique. Fatebringer was the [b]ONLY[/b] year 1 hand cannon with firefly and VoC was the only scout with full auto up until House of Wolves. The burns were just an extra to top it all off

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  • See this decesion boggled my mind. I had more loudout variety befire this. Gonna do vault of glass? Deck out in void for minotaurs. Doing CE? Solar for wizards. Fighting fallen? Arc for captains. I had loadouts for difderent enemies to take out shields better. Now i alnost exclusively use tlaloc because there is no reason to use anything else. I definitely had more weapon variety use before this.

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    • I'm fine with them removing elements, but they need something else to make HM an attractive option. Just running fur infusion material is going to get old quick. I was running VoG and CE right up until the end of Y1 because there were still awesome guns I didn't have. At the moment, I can't see myself doing the same with Kings Fall.

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    • I like it. If i didn't use fatebringer or VoC in year one i just felt like i was putting myself at a disadvantage.

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    • Except half of the users DIDN'T vote negatively or positively, it's like 50 ppl total probably lol. The poll results are such a tiny, inconsequential minority of the entire community. Even if it were, hypothetically everyone, most can't see passed next week to realize how detrimental elemental primaries are to the game if ALL primaries had an element, then sure, but they don't. You break shields with your abilities and other two weapons, primaries are your basic damage workhorses. I'm glad they've made this decision for the game's future.

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    • Once again people are mad that they no longer get they're game breaking guns (exotic or elemental primary). It's a reason. In year one everyone used the the same weapons because there was no reason not to. And it opens up a new level of game play

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      • Glad for no elements. Especially for match game.[spoiler]oh have arc pulse rifle gotta use solar rocket now![/spoiler]

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      • You are right. I am using hung jury until I got the raid pulse rifle with firefly. However in year 1 all I ever used was elemental primaries for all pve content. I don't mind this change.

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      • Edited by wiksta: 10/24/2015 5:13:40 AM
        What about the Zhalo supercell?

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        • Edited by Trestero: 10/24/2015 6:57:47 AM
          I don't think I've seen anyone suggest this exact thing; why not have type modifier overrides available as a gear item, either linked to artifacts or as a separate slot? Wouldn't it work to just let us load mags with charged ammunition into our guns to get an element, temporary or otherwise? You could pull out your ghost and push a certain button to telemetry the Light-charged ammo into your next reload, maybe make it an infinite use on a timer. It would also be interesting to have it for all weapon slots; if your shotgun isn't working against the rare mob with a non-matching shield you could slot in a few rounds that worked and take it out.

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        • Having kinetics do more than using incorrect element types is a great idea. And don't forget the usefulness of kinetic weapons in crucible, as there's no benefit to having elemental primaries.

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        • They need to do something that gives you an elemental primary. I it really felt like you had something special. Also with that match game mod for nighrfalls i could use a little more help

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        • We ran Destiny without those before. I don't see a problem, I'm doing just fine.

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        • ID BE FINE IF MATCH GAME WASNT A THING

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        • I would also be happy if they fixed the rng

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        • Nah, just make kinetic not suck dick. Make it do something holy shit.

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        • Guns like fatebringer totally outclassed every single PVE primary in the game except maybe VOC. Now instead of having that you can allow people to use what they want and not be handcuffed by elemental damage.

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          • As much as I'm disappointed there are no elemental primary weapons, I can live with it. Honestly, in year 1 I can't remember many times that Fatebringer, Praedyth's Timepiece, or the VoC weren't in my primary spot (apart from when they were obsolete during TDB... even then they still wrecked in nightfalls).

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          • The problem is that the new raid weapons are average excluding the pulse and machine gun. So the statistics would show people using other weapons more but if they were amazing as previous raid weapons even without elemental damage it would be everyone's go-to.

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          • A. Elemental primaries were used to make end game content way too easy. B. It seems as if they replaced element burns with specific enemy burns. Like the raid weapons all drop with Will of Light as an extra damage buff, instead of a weapon that will do against every enemy with a certain shield, they'll do well against an entire race or specific enemy of that race. Also allows for more variety depending on perk sets and why a Raid anything of the same light as a nonRaid gun will do more damage. C. By not having them it allows people to use variety in whatever encounter they do, unless you know about D. which we'll get to in a second. Anyways, some people will prefer Hung Jury, some people will prefer The Vanity, some people will prefer Imago Loop, some people will prefer Apple of Discord, others still will prefer The Villainy and yet someone else may go with Answering Chord. D. You're over 300 light, and facing a solar activity. Normally we'd bust out the effective solar gun for that level...well now there technically is none, or is there? Nightfall is a 280 activity, say it has solar burn, seeing you're a 300 with everything else, crack out that VoC on Nightfall. You will do more DPS with your 170 primary being around a 285 light than someone using their Hung Jury being 300 light. It's a 280 light activity and you're total light will be higher than the activity even with a Y1 weapon.

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            • I really like your ideas on how elements should be applied to game. It makes perfect sense and now that I think about it, your idea has had to have crossed Bungie's mind. Looking at swords and their ability to block significant amounts of damage from opposite elements it is the same basic idea you proposed. The same goes for one of the new Nightfall modifiers called match game where enemy shields are highly resistant to the opposite element. Looking at those two aspects it is a cool idea but, it's an idea that should have been implemented from the beginning. It would give so much more meaning to damage types and provide actual thought into our weapon selections. Deej! Cozmo! Hear OP's words and shove them down the developers' throats until they get the idea!

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            • They should make it so that if we infuse a non elemental primary with an elemental one, the infused weapon will adopt the donor weapon's element. That way we can still have elemental primaries but still keep the variety they want us to have.

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              • I just want to say that just because 54% of the people who answered this poll negatively, it doesn't mean shit. Not everyone who uses the forums will see this post, and even fewer people who play destiny will ever go on the forums. Half of a fraction, of a fraction, of the playerbase is upset with these changes is essentially what the poll says.

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                • No, this allows people to choose vender weapons if they want to, instead of needing to use the raid weapons.

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                  • I definitely won't be playing the HM raid multiple times to have all the best raid weapons for all three characters like I did with VoG and Crota...because the TTK raid weapons can't hold a candle to the overall usability of year one raid weapons. I would agree with the notion that Bungie screwed the pooch with the raid weapons in general.

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                  • I'm just saying, in my personal experience, I'm seeing more variety in Primary weapons than I ever have since launch. I like this system. I don't value one gun over another simply because one has a burn on it

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                    • I think your first idea is smart. Kinetic damage is the same, but wrong damage type is lessened.

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