originally posted in:Thorny Guardians
I can agree with some of your points, disagree with some of them, and a few of them are either common sense or I don't care about them enough to agree or disagree.
I do agree that you should be a fairly high level. 26, I think, is a good starting level. I was 26 first time I did the raid. It was still incredibly challenging. But it was still super fun.
The main thing I disagree with, though, is if they don't have enough time. Of course it's not a strike. If you're too self centered to think that if someone leaves and your progress on the VoG is going to be severely hampered, then it deserves to be. You have one whole week from the progress reset. For people who haven't done it just yet, they might need a few days. They haven't done it enough to go through it in one run. You need to be patient with them and just exit to orbit if they have to leave and continue as a full fireteam tomorrow with them instead of inviting a level 30 right as they leave. That's pathetic and disrespectful. Even if you only take 30-45 minutes a day on each part, you'll get done before the weekly reset. Get through the door, find your way to the Templar's Well, and there, you can leave and join someone else's fireteam so that you can complete the raid. Just be sure and help your buddy that had to leave finish it when he comes back tomorrow.
I've been on both ends of the stick though. Sometimes I've been the guy who has to leave. Normally when that happens it's fairly late and we all agree we'll team back up the next day around the time we started at. I still haven't seen this happen lol. I've also been frustrated that someone had to leave, allowing us not to finish. I joined another team who was just starting and we got it done from first to last ;) and then when my original team was getting back together I went and helped them through the rest of it because I made a commitment to them that I was going to help them get all the way through it. And we did. I've even helped people I didn't know at all through the raid, after I'd already finished the raid 3 or more times in a week. But I digress; you don't have to complete the raid in one fell swoop.
And I severely disagree with your statements about using mics. I do have a headset. But all of my playtime in Destiny, my headset was 5 states away. One of the good ones that has the in-game audio and sliders to adjust the volume of the game and voice chat separately. Would've been awesome if I'd had it, I could've gotten a lot more done. But I didn't have a mic at all. 120+ hours without a mic. I felt naked. But, I've still managed to complete the raid a handful of times. Many of those times I'd pay close attention to how many kills I get compared to everyone else. I was normally the top killer. I would also die the least, get spotted in the Gaze the least, kill the most oracles, kill the most praetorians, and kill the most supplicants. When other people would die I would keep a timer in my head and slowly work my way towards them while keeping the enemies down, or just flat out get to their orb as quickly as possible and defend their corpse until revive was available. But I was never able to talk.
So I made use of pointing, sitting, dancing, and hiding somewhere while I SENT THE LEADER A MESSAGE that he could relay to the rest of the team so we could quit wiping. I probably sent forty messages that night. I was getting frustrated. By the end of the night, though, they knew if I wasn't moving that I was about to make it easier for them, and we were about to wipe. So they all jumped, and when I sent the message I waited for it to be read aloud and I jumped too.
For those of you who think you absolutely need a mic to play the VoG: you don't. It isn't needed. There is not one area that requires you to open your loud mouth. If the first thing that comes to your mind is the Atheon fight, where you need to tell the three on the supplicant side which portal portal to open, let me let you in on a secret: you can figure out which portal to open if you just look at your radar. I was already opening the portal by the time the relic crew even remembered to let us know they were on Venus.
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There´s probably two reasons why your team succeeded without you wearing a mic: First, your Fireteam Leader was awesome. Leading the team in the VoG with one hand while reading texts with the other? That takes some serious skill. Second, and more importantly, you didn't have a mic, but [i]everyone else.[/i] did. Imagine a VoG where everybody did the same as you did. No one providing instructions, no one calling out locations or potential threats. Even the most veteran raid team would have a hard time getting it done in those conditions. You and your team managed to work around the problem of having one member not being able to communicate effectively. Kudos to your team. Now, i suggest you go to the store, get that $10 Mic, and stop making the VoG harder than it needs to be for everybody else. Specially your Team Leader, I'm betting the gesture will be appreciated.
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Spot on!
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Edited by Lannik: 10/24/2014 5:58:22 PMSure [u][b][i]ONE[/i][/b][/u] member of your Fireteam (you) not having a Mic might not be hugely detrimental... but could you imagine if everybody approached this with the same attitude? Would you want to be in a Fireteam where [i]nobody[/i] had mics because "they didn't need it?" where every message was communicated through texts? It's more of a courtesy thing in my mind. I use my Mic even though I'd rather not, and personally see no need for it (since I know what I'm doing) because I understand that I would much rather use a mic than encourage others not to use theirs. So you have a special case where you know what you're doing AND you just happen to not have access to your mic, but I wouldn't so readily promote not using mics because I assure you, they very much are needed for group cohesion--particularly in PuGs and when certain raid members aren't incredibly experienced with the content.
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Edited by TheOneAndOnlyDC: 10/24/2014 5:24:57 PMYou need a mic for the VoG. Is it possible to do it without one? Sure. Do most people want to be in a Raid with someone who doesn't have a mic? WIth someone who can't call out Oracles etc.? With someone who can't partake in joking around and generally having a good time throughout? No. No they don't. Get a mic.
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Agreed!
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No, you dont NEED a mic to play, but it helps out an extreme amount. Nobody wants to take the time to read your stupid msg, or try to figure out why your pointing at a wall or dancing like an idiot. Get a mic so you dont have to get frustrated typeing all 40 of thoes msg's, what a waste of time. Go to the store and buy one , Wally world is open 24hrs.
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OK, you go into a raid with the whole group without a mic that hasn't done the raid before and see how far you get.
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Edited by Stealthy: 10/24/2014 4:51:20 PMAgreed, you don't need a mic if you bring minimal skill. You see when people die. After the first run, you know the tactics - which aren't that diffucult to understand "don't stand in the green glowing pools", "position yourself on the portal plates" and all the rest ... Are just the same in most games. When you need to form groups at Atheon, those groups should have already formed partially by defeating the other stages - and to clarify things you can always shoot people in the head and afterwards to the place they should go, point etc.. If they aren't dumb, they will understand you. "You need a mic otherwise you can't raid". If you are stupid as hell maybe. Just the same as people say "you need a mic" in wow arena pvp ... You don't.
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First of all, most people are "stupid as hell". Secondly, teamwork, while not impossible, is certainly much easier with vocal communications.