[b]Edit[/b] [i]What this post was meant to be: A useful strategy guide for hard raid that could be updated based on success. What it turned out to be: "My Hunter [b]is[/b] f*cking useful you big fat stupid ugly chode. Glad to help...[/i] Like most people, I am pretty upset over this upcoming patch. Before people start bitching, no I don't give a sh*t about pushing Atheon off. I've always agreed that doing that was cheating and not the way Bungie intended for a final boss fight of the hardest material in the game to be defeated. I'm talking about Atheon teleporting 3 random players instead of 3 predetermined players. This is ridiculous, but instead of yelling into the void (which is exactly what talking to Bungie is like), I've started planning how my group of 5 friends and I are going to topple the new and improved beast. Disclaimer: This is not tested. This is just me thinking of different ideas while at work. I have been apart of both the home team and away team and have a good idea of the mechanics of how both are done. [b]Starting Off[/b] Everyone stands in the back. No sense in people opening portals or splitting up, because all 3 could be sent inside. Everyone gets together so it's easier to pick up the pieces. [b]First Teleport[/b] [i]Away Team[/i] [b]First and foremost, designate 2 people out of your 6 man team to never pick up the relic.[/b] With 3 randomly getting teleported, grabbing the relic will be the most chaotic part. If those [b]2[/b] are teleported, then obviously the 3rd will grab it. Those 2 can immediately start taking down the enemies. Now, if 3 people who have permission to grab the relic are teleported, there must be communication, but after the relic is picked up. You can't afford to waste charge time on the cleanse talking out who gets the relic. Everyone immediately attempt to grab it. If you don't have it, you obviously pull out your rocket launcher and blast the little f*ckers at the bottom of the stairs, then pull out Atheons Epilogue or Pocket Infinity and go after those Oracles. If you did get the relic, holler it out so people know for sure someone got it, then jump down and clear out what's left below, run back up and cleanse (repeatedly). Once the last 2 Oracles pop up, get out of the portal and jump to the middle and hold cleanse. [i]Home Team[/i] Immediately after the teleport, keep your mouth shut. It's going to be mayhem for the away team, and they need to figure out who has the relic and where they are. There's nothing you need to communicate at that point anyways. Wait until you hear the callout of where they are (Right/Left, Green/Yellow, Venus/Mars), and everyone head to that portal to make sure it's open. It is highly recommended that you get to high ground, so that the supplicants can't kamikaze you. You'll get 3 waves of supplicants that need to be destroyed, particularly that last group. They have a tendency to hover around the exit portal and explode the bloody sh*t out of whoever comes out of the portal first, which is usually (and should be) the relic holder. If you aren't able to clear the "runway", please let the inside team know so that they can expect to leave and not immediately jump to the middle. [b]SIDENOTE[/b] [i]From here on out, I'm going to assume you have at least one Defender Titan. In my opinion, the perfect hard raid team is Sunsingers and Defenders. No offense Hunters, I'm sure you're skilled, but there's no real benefit of having you in there since you can't invisi-res.[/i] [u]Edit: [/u]Ok Hunters, calm down. Not saying you're trash, you're just not beneficial. Warlock with self-res is a free death, for the stupid mistakes. Titan with bubble is the most supportive class in the game. Sure you're little Goldengun can one shot Oracles, but you're lack of armour and recovery makes you very squishy. Also, the Oracles are not that hard to take down. I'm not saying having you is a detriment, I'm just saying it's not a benefit. Put the knives away and get back to criticizing my strategy, not my opinions on classes. [b]Middle Area[/b] At this point, everyone should jump to the middle platform right in front of Atheon. The supplicants can't reach you there, and you can hide safely inside the relic's shield. This shouldn't need mentioning, but you can shoot out of the shield without anything getting in, [b]EXCEPT ROCKETS[/b]. Don't shoot rockets from inside the shield. Just don't do it. If you feel you need to shoot rockets, jump up extremely high and let her rip. But the only people who should be shooting rockets should be Gjallarhorn-ers, because that sh*t is just ridiculous. Right when everyone lands on the middle platform, the Defender Titan needs to drop his personal bubble shield in the back of the platform. It needs to be Weapons of Light, with Bastion and Illuminated as the passives. Everyone else, [b]it is worth stepping back into[/b]. It increases your damage substantially. If you have 2 Defenders, I also recommend putting a Blessing of Light bubble inside the Weapons bubble, as you'll be retreating into the bubbles shortly. During Time's Vengeance, everyone just unload on Atheon, particularly his crit spot. The relic holder is just going to continually cleanse, and call out the time remaining in intervals of 5. Once it gets down to 5 seconds (recommended), everyone needs to back into the Titan bubbles. This is the main difference. This is usually where the away team runs to the back and the home team goes to stand on Sync Plates, but there is no point in that. I have entertained the idea of splitting evenly 3 on left and 3 on right, but I think it isn't worth it. Firstly, you don't have your bearing's straight. You're just jumping out there and hoping you don't land on a supplicant. Secondly, the entire left team could be teleported, which means the right team would have to take extra time navigating around to the left. Thirdly, on the hard raid, the home team gets stuck in detainment shields, and if you're in the air when those hit, that's a wipe. Staying in the middle, real easy to break detainment, while being safe under the bubble. I believe the best choice is to stay in the middle, in the Defender's bubbles. Defenders, please go out of your way to pop an extra bubble around 1-2 seconds left of Time's Vengeance, just to make sure the duration lasts long enough. [u]This will also give both teams Weapons/Blessing of Light for a few seconds into the next phase. [/u] [b]Second Teleport[/b] [i]Away Team[/i] This is exactly the same thing as the first teleport, except you have the benefits of Weapons and/or Blessing of Light. Mad dash to pick up the relic (unless you're one of the 2 that shouldn't, in which case you go straight for the enemies), call out what side you are on, and take out all the oracles. When you're done head to the middle. [i]Home Team[/i] Home team is slightly different for the hard raid. Normally, you're standing on top of your sync plates, ready to go. Since it's random, you're just hanging out in the middle, under the Defender bubble. Again, [b]keep your mouth shut.[/b] You're part requires no communication at the moment, and the away team is going to be scrambling. Simply stay in the bubble and take note of where the quickest escape route is going to be until you hear the callout from the away team. Once you know which portal to open, leave the bubbles and open the sync plates. Please remember to let the away team know if the "runway" is cleared for takeoff. [i]From here on out, this is just wash, rinse, repeat.[/i] Now, the main reason I posted this is because I want to know if ANYONE thinks this is an exploit or cheating or not the way the game was intended to be played. Because if not, Bungie has no reason to patch the VoG again, and we can continue to grind it without having to deal with more crap they throw in. In no was is this patch an increase in difficulty, it is just a frustration. It takes strategy out of the raid, which, in every other game, raids are pretty much [b]only strategy.[/b] I'm very upset with the patch, but, again, life goes on. [b]TL;DR[/b] Umm...Got nothing for ya. Pretty much need to read the whole thing, or not at all. If anyone has any ideas they would like to add or take away, please let me know. Hope this helps people, and hope it works. I'll post an edit on Tuesday evening, letting those interested know if we pulled it out, and with what ease. RP [u]Edit:[/u]To all the people who think the [b]heirarchy[/b] of relic holders is a good idea- I thought a long time about that before I posted this and I came to the conclusion (at least with my group) that it's not worth it. The main problem is the fact that everyone would be yelling names and/or numbers of who got teleported at the same time, and you'd have to take time to think what your assignment is according to who else is with you, and who is ahead of you who should be taking it. My method, everyone remains silent until the shield is picked up and that person says they have it, then tells everyone the portal location (as it's been pointed out, not a necessity; check radar). The reason I chose this method is because, while I'm the best with the relic in my group, 2 others are good and 1 has used it enough to be passable. So with any 1 of those 4 being teleported (remember, 2 don't have permission to grab relic ever), I know if I don't have it, it's in good hands, and also it takes the least amount of time to figure out. Just my thoughts. Really looking forward to trying this out and letting everyone know my findings tomorrow. Hope it's been of some help.