This narrative needs to end, quite frankly. "Suicide is selfish". Completely wrong, man. Suicide from depression -can't- be selfish, because that requires the rational decision to do something to only your own benefit: the brain in the grips of uncontrolled depression is incapable of being rational enough to make that decision. And I want it noted that I said -clinical- depression, because there's a massive difference between being clinically depressed and simply depressed; one is caused by circumstances, the other is caused by a minute structural change in the brain that prevents it from producing the proper amount of neurotransmitters, thus preventing your brain from functioning in certain ways. When someone hits the bottom stages of clinical depression, especially if it's compounded with situational depression, the rationality and logic of the mind degrade. It's the same as rage, or panic, fight or flight: the chemistry of your brain is steering far more than your thoughts. It's not a 'snap out of it' moment, because your brain is bathed in a mixture of chemistry that quite literally [i]will not allow it.[/i] This is why counseling and medications are so important: one can help you reprogram parts of your mind through cognitive feedback and perspective shifting and the other tries to correct the chemical imbalances, thus allowing your brain to function more normally while you sort things out. But selfish? No. Your vision narrows to only be able to see this one thing, this becomes the only possibility. Nothing else makes sense, you're pointed toward it like an arrow. Once in a while, something else flashes in, but it's quickly dismissed in a storm of finality and despair. And you think of all the people that it will hurt, and that makes everything hurt worse. You think of how much this will hurt them all. And because your brain isn't functioning normally and properly, the fact that you'd be willing to hurt them all like this only fuels the fire; you see what a piece of wasted, pointless, terrible $#!+ you are, to be willing to do this to them, and that only makes it make more sense to die and leave them; if you're willing to do this, you just imagine the things that you'd do if you stayed alive. It's an uncontrolled illness, not someone just giving up for their own sake, get this straight. So please, do some research, even just an hour, and learn more about this. 'Suicide is selfish' is what people that have never truly been in danger of killing themselves says to other people. Even if you've had the gun to your head, if you aren't overwhelmed in despair or don't have an abnormal brain, your self preservation instincts were always going to stop you. Don't blame the victims that were betrayed by their own minds. Find ways to understand it more, and maybe you can be part of the solution, instead of someone that parrots a meaningless, unhelpful, and incorrect catch phrase after the fact.

It's possibly the only thing that is both selfish and incredibly brave, at the same time. Lots of ppl think about it, few actually have the balls to do it.

It is in no way brave. It's cowardice. Just the opposite. Living is hard and deciding all I have to do is jump, take these pills, etc is literally saying "I never have to make another choice again. I never have to deal with the consequences of what I'm about to do. I never have to worry about how badly it effects the lives around me that could have also already been suffering." Cowardice. I feel for those who suffer this much depression but I feel no matter what your mental illness you still have a semblance of choice. Otherwise a drug addict would never recover. Some do and some don't. It comes down to their willpower. The choice to use again after a month or two sober is most definitely still a choice. And suicide is still a choice. We have to be responsible for our actions otherwise more and more fall down the dark path because they think they aren't responsible. Otherwise you might as well not hold a mass shooter responsible.

Nope, very brave. I wouldn't have the balls to jump. I would chicken out every time.

That makes you a coward in general. Too afraid to take the risk to find other options and too afraid to take the dive and end it.

Could have just given your condolences and walked away. But no, gotta get some jabs in on a dead man, a fellow vet no less. A lot of classless twits in this community, what a shame.